The Official 2pac Versus Biggie Thread...

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  • illogicsillogics Posts: 2,480
    edited February 2010
    uhh............................ i never said that.. i more or less said that the way he wrote the album was an eye opening thing to others who'd listen to it. he got out & made the same mistakes that got him locked up.. that in itself should be a lesson to the casual observer.

    & for the record, my favorite album of all time is "Let's Get Free" by dead prez purely because of it's conscious nature. never forget there's more than one way to reach your point. biggie just reached that point by way of the least common denominator.

    Oh well you quoted me after I disagreed with Rapmastermind when he said "Ready To Die is one of the most conscience albums in Hip Hop History" so I thought that's what your post was trying to defend.
  • rusty shacklefordrusty shackleford Posts: 1,730
    edited February 2010
    illogics wrote: »
    Oh well you quoted me after I disagreed with Rapmastermind when he said "Ready To Die is one of the most conscience albums in Hip Hop History" so I thought that's what your post was trying to defend.
    i never thought its was conscious in the slightest till Rap brought it to our attention. & being that he was just puttin' his self in the shoes of the people who have to do whatever it takes to get by for the listener's perspective, the conscious aspect can't be denied when at the end of the day [no remy], we're supposed to learn from other's mistakes.. no?
  • jrod44jrod44 Posts: 3,446
    edited February 2010
    yall keep omitting what the ammo would be? What would BIG say? Yall saying lyrical, sure he can make up a story, how he is gonna make a comeback to Hit em up?
  • rapmastermindrapmastermind Posts: 5,426
    edited February 2010
    illogics wrote: »
    Oh well you quoted me after I disagreed with Rapmastermind when he said "Ready To Die is one of the most conscience albums in Hip Hop History" so I thought that's what your post was trying to defend.


    Again conscience albums aren't always political, uplifting and spirital. "RTD" is conscience cause of it's raise and fall concept. Biggie started the album from birth and ended the album with death. "Suicidal Thoughts" is one of the most conscience songs on hip hop history. How many rappers ever showed that type of honesty on a track? To look in the mirror and talk about the faults was very powerful and more people need to do that in their own lives. The Moral of "RTD" makes it a conscience album. which was this life has two endings "Dead or in Jail". Biggie gave you a story of that experience but made sure the bad guy didn't get away in the end. Which shows many people the trappings of being a Black Male in America that makes the album extremely conscious in that way (Considered a fool cause I dropped out of high school, stereotypes of a black male misunderstood). Again it's not the "BEST" but it's one of the the best.
  • rusty shacklefordrusty shackleford Posts: 1,730
    edited February 2010
    jrod44 wrote: »
    yall keep omitting what the ammo would be? What would BIG say? Yall saying lyrical, sure he can make up a story, how he is gonna make a comeback to Hit em up?
    he can always talk about how pac is famous & still had to rape a chick.. [with another grown man's help] then in return got raped for his trouble.. that's a fuckin' goldmine..
  • illogicsillogics Posts: 2,480
    edited February 2010
    i never thought its was conscious in the slightest till Rap brought it to our attention. & being that he was just puttin' his self in the shoes of the people who have to do whatever it takes to get by for the listener's perspective, the conscious aspect can't be denied when at the end of the day [no remy], we're supposed to learn from other's mistakes.. no?

    I can't tell what stance you have anymore. I point out songs and ask you if think they're conscious, you say "I never said they were". And now your saying you didn't think it was conscious until rapmastermind bought it to your attention. What's going on?
  • BOSS KTULUBOSS KTULU Posts: 978
    edited February 2010
    jrod44 wrote: »
    yall keep omitting what the ammo would be? What would BIG say? Yall saying lyrical, sure he can make up a story, how he is gonna make a comeback to Hit em up?

    what's lyrical about sleeping with your rival's whore wife? pac didnt win anything based on lyrics, he just had niggas in the streets thinking he was a gangbanger


    bottom line: SNOOP DOGGY DOGG says christopher wallace >>>> whatever tupac's goofy birth name was

    lol at your crack addict momma giving you a faggy birth name and having to change it

    damn pac lost
  • rapmastermindrapmastermind Posts: 5,426
    edited February 2010
    illogics wrote: »
    How are those songs perfect ways to prove your point? Those are "conscious" songs to you? Songs like Machine Gun Funk, Gimme The Loot etc?


    The only songs from "RTD" that I would classify as conscience are "Things Dun Changed", "Ready To Die", "Juicy", "Everyday Struggle" and "Sucidal Thoughts" Those songs touch on very deep things. Everything else plays it's role but the album as a whole works as a Hardcore/Conscience/Commerical/Concept album it was a very broad record.
  • jrod44jrod44 Posts: 3,446
    edited February 2010
    BOSS KTULU wrote: »
    what's lyrical about sleeping with your rival's whore wife? pac didnt win anything based on lyrics, he just had niggas in the streets thinking he was a gangbanger


    bottom line: SNOOP DOGGY DOGG says christopher wallace >>>> whatever tupac's goofy birth name was

    lol at your crack addict momma giving you a faggy birth name and having to change it

    damn pac lost

    So you think Big woulda led with that? Faggy name? Yo I fucked your wife and Big responds with you gotta faggy name, sounds bout right. Yo son, dems lyrics.
  • rapmastermindrapmastermind Posts: 5,426
    edited February 2010
    BOSS KTULU wrote: »
    what's lyrical about sleeping with your rival's whore wife? pac didnt win anything based on lyrics, he just had niggas in the streets thinking he was a gangbanger


    bottom line: SNOOP DOGGY DOGG says christopher wallace >>>> whatever tupac's goofy birth name was

    lol at your crack addict momma giving you a faggy birth name and having to change it

    damn pac lost


    There was nothing "Lyrical" about "Hit Em Up" and Pac had some nerve saying the Outlaws could see Biggie. Biggie would of bodied them dudes with no problem. What made "Hit Em up" work was Faith's shady a$$ f'in with Pac. That opening line makes the song more than any of the song itself. But give Pac props, it was a very effective diss. Also flipping Biggie's "Get Money Remix" beat and hook was very smart on Pac's part but it also showed that Pac was listening to Big since he bit Biggie's hook and flow on the diss(Take Moeny) (Grab your glocks when you see Tupac, call the cops when you see Tupac). Pac admitted right there how dope Biggie was. Even Pac knew "Get Money" was the anthem.
  • rusty shacklefordrusty shackleford Posts: 1,730
    edited February 2010
    illogics wrote: »
    I can't tell what stance you have anymore. I point out songs and ask you if think they're conscious, you say "I never said they were". And now your saying you didn't think it was conscious until rapmastermind bought it to your attention. What's going on?
    okay.. lets try this.

    say you spent your 19th birthday locked up & just got out when ready to die dropped.. the street is constantly at your door step. a lot of the people you know have their hands on elbows, keys, tabs & sheets.. & the whole time, you're marinatin' on this album where dudes in the same spot you are & ends up on that destructive path like he never left it.. could the artwork/album not be looked at as a conscious effort for your benifit? forget about the gun talk for a second... he made the right choice in not fuckin' with the triple beam & BEGAN HIS RAP CAREER.. & only wrote about what can happen to you if you don't learn a lesson from your time at the only summer camp with bars on it's windows.. <-that is a conscious decision to make an impression with your life experience on people who you hope are smart enough to listen & heed your warning..

    or maby thats just me [& my perspective].
  • One SpliffOne Spliff Posts: 5,344
    edited February 2010
    "thats why i fucked your bitch you fat muthafucka"


    close thread.
  • illogicsillogics Posts: 2,480
    edited February 2010
    okay.. lets try this.

    say you spent your 19th birthday locked up & just got out when ready to die dropped.. the street is constantly at your door step. a lot of the people you know have their hands on elbows, keys, tabs & sheets.. & the whole time, you're marinatin' on this album where dudes in the same spot you are & ends up on that destructive path like he never left it.. could the artwork/album not be looked at as a conscious effort for your benifit? forget about the gun talk for a second... he made the right choice in not fuckin' with the triple beam & BEGAN HIS RAP CAREER.. & only wrote about what can happen to you if you don't learn a lesson from your time at the only summer camp with bars on it's windows.. <-that is a conscious decision to make an impression with your life experience on people who you hope are smart enough to listen & heed your warning..

    or maby its me. i doubt it though.

    I'm basing my opinion on the music itself and not BIG's personal life experiences/decisions.

    That's just me though.
  • Fazeem_Blackall Fazeem_Blackall Posts: 4,216
    edited February 2010
    those are all perfect ways to prove my point.."Don't worry ladies.. keep ya head up... But I get around so don't get mad when i bust a nut on you & am out the door two seconds later to fuck with another broad.. Just be happy with this quicky.. BUT KEEP YO HEAD UP."

    with me now?
    I am not sure why a admitted fag would comment on the normal contradictory relations between a man and a woman, you already turned your back on that shit you have no room to even speak on anything of that nature as it is against yours...
  • rusty shacklefordrusty shackleford Posts: 1,730
    edited February 2010
    illogics wrote: »
    I'm basing my opinion on the music itself and not BIG's personal life experiences/decisions.

    & that's where you come up short.. you can't take the art into consideration without considering the source or the work. this is all elementary.
  • rusty shacklefordrusty shackleford Posts: 1,730
    edited February 2010
    I am not sure why a admitted fag would comment..
    & i'm not sure why you'd run in here & swan dive onto my dick with your first post [with the added irony of callin' me a fag].. so i guess we're both in the dark. the only difference between you & I is that i can afford my light bill.. : )
  • illogicsillogics Posts: 2,480
    edited February 2010
    & that's where you come up short.. you can't take the art ibnto consideration without considering the source or the work. this is all elementary.

    So I can call a rapper like Soulja Boy a conscious rapper not based on his content, but because of decisions and steps he took in his personal life? I'm sorry, that makes absolutely NO sense.
  • rapmastermindrapmastermind Posts: 5,426
    edited February 2010
    One Spliff wrote: »
    "thats why i fucked your bitch you fat muthafucka"


    close thread.


    "Your bleeding lovley, with your spirit above me/or beneath me, your whole life you live sneeky/ now rest eternally sleepy, you burn you creep me/rest where the worms and weak be/my 9 flies, baptize, rap guys"

    "N!ggas is actors, N!ggas deserves Oscars/Me, I'm critically acclaimed/slug pass your brain"
  • rusty shacklefordrusty shackleford Posts: 1,730
    edited February 2010
    illogics wrote: »
    So I can call a rapper like Soulja Boy a conscious rapper not based on his content, but because of decisions and steps he took in his personal life? I'm sorry, that makes absolutely NO sense.
    i have the unfortunate disadvantage of not knowing a sliver of information about him to be able to honestly answer that. i stopped listening to gangsta rap when it died on march 9th..
  • illogicsillogics Posts: 2,480
    edited February 2010
    i have the unfortunate disadvantage of not knowing a sliver of information about him to be able to honestly answer that. i stopped listening to gangsta rap when it died on march 9th..

    But the only information you need is to LISTEN TO THE MUSIC. You have to read a rappers biography to categorize him as a "conscious" rapper?

    Ridiculous.
  • rusty shacklefordrusty shackleford Posts: 1,730
    edited February 2010
    "Your bleeding lovley, with your spirit above me/or beneath me, your whole life you live sneeky/ now rest eternally sleepy, you burn you creep me/rest where the worms and weeds be/my 9 flies, baptize, rap guys"

    "N!ggas is actors, N!ggas deserves Oscars/Me, I'm critically acclaimed/slug pass your brain"
    American_Idol_reaction.gif


    _minigun__by_Mrichston.gifmurDER!!!!!!!!!
  • bless the childbless the child Posts: 3,036
    edited February 2010
    Could have...but he didnt...He did the same shit Jay-z does...
  • BOSS KTULUBOSS KTULU Posts: 978
    edited February 2010
    One Spliff wrote: »
    "thats why i fucked your bitch you fat muthafucka"


    close thread.

    adlibs are not lyrics

    open thread

    lol at pac stans

    faggots
  • rusty shacklefordrusty shackleford Posts: 1,730
    edited February 2010
    illogics wrote: »
    But the only information you need is to LISTEN TO THE MUSIC. You have to read a rappers biography to categorize him as a "conscious" rapper?

    Ridiculous.
    there you go again.. i never said big was a conscious mc.. i only insinuated that you can't discount the way he wrote his 1st album as being a negative-positive.. those feelings of "if i die, fuck it i wanna go to hell / cause i'm a peice of shit, it aint hard to fuckin' tell.." had to be a motivator [along with his new daughter] in his decision to keep rappin'.. that shows you right there he wasn't the selfish asshole who was spittin' those words.. otherwise, he woulda took the easy way out like his BIG personna did.. thats a conscious decision. all i can say to someone who can't feel that is... maby you will in about 5 to 10 years.. maturity brings a priceless enlightenment inexperience can't afford.. or even concieve of for that matter.
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