› › ›

Hardcore v The Miseducation - Which LP is more important to hip hop?

2

Replies

  • Pun1sherPun1sher Posts: 424
    mr.getwitcha wrote: »
    Hardcore was trash. Niggas only bought it for the album cover and the pin up that was inside. The only ones talking about Hardcore being a classic was the ones that were hating on Nicki Minaj.


    Getwitcha

    I wasn't too, too big on Kim...even though I thought she was dope for what she did. A lot of that feminist, "niggas ain't shit" persona turned me off a bit. And I really didn't like how she portrayed dudes as mere sex objects, who were only good for eating pussy.

    Now with that said, a lot of people will advocate for Hardcore having changed the game, especially for females in hip hop. I've never heard such a proclamation bestowed upon The Miseducation, as much I've just heard people say Lauryn just dropped a really good album...nothing groundbreaking...just really good.

    Now if we go by this mentality, which album is important? Though I'm still trying to figure out exactly what people mean when they say Hardcore changed the game. What exactly did it do?
    Flag • Wack Feelings Nosign Cosign Ether GOAT LOL •
  • soul rattlersoul rattler Posts: 10,144
    You're the only one on the IC that can name 5 Jean Grae songs.
    Pun1sher wrote: »
    Did Lil Kim really pioneer her style, though?

    No. Biggie did.
    Flag • Wack Feelings Nosign Cosign Ether GOAT LOL •
  • Pun1sherPun1sher Posts: 424
    soul rattler wrote: »
    You're the only one on the IC that can name 5 Jean Grae songs.

    Proof?

    And the ultimate funny at you insinuating Jean Grae is a nobody...when even on Lauryn's BEST day, she still couldn't wipe the shit that comes outta Jean's ass, let alone see her musically.
    Flag • Wack Feelings Nosign Cosign Ether GOAT LOL •
  • soul rattlersoul rattler Posts: 10,144
    Pun1sher wrote: »
    Proof?

    And the ultimate funny at you insinuating Jean Grae is a nobody...when even on Lauryn's BEST day, she still couldn't wipe the shit that comes outta Jean's ass, let alone see her musically.
    Who the fuck is Jean Grae? How long has she been around and why is it nobody knows or gives a fuck about her besides Talib Kweli? Where is her piece of work that everybody universally hails as musical and lyrical perfection?
    Flag • Wack Feelings Nosign Cosign Ether GOAT LOL •
  • DMTxCannabisDMTxCannabis Posts: 13,326
    Lil Kim====>Nicki Minaj
    Flag • Wack Feelings Nosign Cosign Ether GOAT LOL •
  • c1upc1up Posts: 10,770
    L Boog had the impact
    Kim had the influence
    Jean due to her not being marketable is awesome on the mic
    Flag • Wack Feelings Nosign Cosign Ether GOAT LOL •
  • soul rattlersoul rattler Posts: 10,144
    DMTxCannabis wrote: »
    Lil Kim====>Nicki Minaj

    At what? Reading someone else's lyrics?
    Flag • Wack Feelings Nosign Cosign Ether GOAT LOL •
  • soul rattlersoul rattler Posts: 10,144
    c1up wrote: »
    L Boog had the impact
    Kim had the influence
    Jean due to her not being marketable is awesome on the mic

    She's awesome on the mic because she's not marketable? Fuck kinda logic is that?

    And how isn't she marketable? You saying she's ugly on top of taking a backseat to Lauryn Hill, MC Lyte, and Queen Latifah?
    Flag • Wack Feelings Nosign Cosign Ether GOAT LOL •
  • Pun1sherPun1sher Posts: 424
    soul rattler wrote: »
    She's awesome on the mic because she's not marketable? Fuck kinda logic is that?

    And how isn't she marketable? You saying she's ugly on top of taking a backseat to Lauryn Hill, MC Lyte, and Queen Latifah?

    Stupid ass, Jean Grae isn't marketable, because lacks a strong PR team.

    Jean has talent, though...unlike BOREyn Hill, whose only talent is tucking her dick in between her legs to hide the fact that she's really a man, idiot.
    Flag • Wack Feelings Nosign Cosign Ether GOAT LOL •
  • BlackGeraldBlackGerald Posts: 12,136
    Pun1sher wrote: »
    Stupid ass, Jean Grae isn't marketable, because lacks a strong PR team.

    Jean has talent, though...unlike BOREyn Hill, whose only talent is tucking her dick in between her legs to hide the fact that she's really a man, idiot.

    And if you look over here, you'll see a full grown feelingcatcher.....
    Flag • Wack Feelings Nosign Cosign Ether GOAT LOL •
  • Just2CJust2C Posts: 931
    Is this a serious question?
    Flag • Wack Feelings Nosign Cosign Ether GOAT LOL •
  • DMTxCannabisDMTxCannabis Posts: 13,326
    DMTxCannabis wrote: »
    Lil Kim====>Nicki Minaj
    soul rattler wrote: »
    At what? Reading someone else's lyrics?

    That was an arrow. I was implying that Nicki was influenced by Kim.
    Flag • Wack Feelings Nosign Cosign Ether GOAT LOL •
  • BlackGeraldBlackGerald Posts: 12,136
    Nicki minaj is the untalented bastard child of lil kim and busta
    Flag • Wack Feelings Nosign Cosign Ether GOAT LOL •
  • soul rattlersoul rattler Posts: 10,144
    DMTxCannabis wrote: »
    That was an arrow. I was implying that Nicki was influenced by Kim.
    Ah... nevermind me then.
    straightupsho wrote: »
    And if you look over here, you'll see a full grown feelingcatcher.....

    co-sign!
    Flag • Wack Feelings Nosign Cosign Ether GOAT LOL •
  • soul rattlersoul rattler Posts: 10,144
    Pun1sher wrote: »
    Stupid ass, Jean Grae isn't marketable, because lacks a strong PR team.

    Jean has talent, though...unlike BOREyn Hill, whose only talent is tucking her dick in between her legs to hide the fact that she's really a man, idiot.

    lol Nobody gives a fuck about Eugene Ga'rae. Give up
    Flag • Wack Feelings Nosign Cosign Ether GOAT LOL •
  • real_hh_repreal_hh_rep Posts: 1,659
    Kim definitely paved the way since talking about taking it in the butt (yes yes ya'll) and sucking tons of dicks became a norm in a female rap from there. L.Hill became a part of big neo-soul movement (along with Erykah Badu and D'ANgelo) and her album had more impact on music generally than on hip-hop itself. Leaving quality off, her work is stronger and more remembered today.
    Flag • Wack Feelings Nosign Cosign Ether GOAT LOL •
  • c1upc1up Posts: 10,770
    soul rattler wrote: »
    She's awesome on the mic because she's not marketable? Fuck kinda logic is that?

    And how isn't she marketable? You saying she's ugly on top of taking a backseat to Lauryn Hill, MC Lyte, and Queen Latifah?

    I'm saying she has neither impact or influence, but she got talent on the mic
    Flag • Wack Feelings Nosign Cosign Ether GOAT LOL •
  • Pun1sherPun1sher Posts: 424
    All facetiousness aside, I think a more direct look into Kim's influence on hip hop needs to be taken here.

    First off, she did not pioneer sex talk. H.W.A. did.

    However, most people will argue that Kim did bring glam to hip hop...and feminized female rappers, by rapping about "girl" things...like fashion and all that other nonsense. However true this may be, it's still more than what anybody has said about Lauryn's LP, other than The Miseducation just being really, really good.

    What did The Miseducation do for the game, exactly...other than just being really good?
    Flag • Wack Feelings Nosign Cosign Ether GOAT LOL •
  • soul rattlersoul rattler Posts: 10,144
    Pun1sher wrote: »
    What did The Miseducation do for the game, exactly...other than just being really good?

    It opened the door and broke boundaries for how people view contemporary women in Hip Hop. Yes, MC Lyte, Queen L, etc. had proven to be lyrically solid as well as have depth and subject matter, but no one perfected their craft more than Lauryn Hill. It's a standard of how great female artists CAN be and it opened up an alternative to the objectifiable lane that Kim, Foxy, Trina, etc. embody.

    That's impact versus influence.
    Flag • Wack Feelings Nosign Cosign Ether GOAT LOL •
  • Pun1sherPun1sher Posts: 424
    soul rattler wrote: »
    It opened the door and broke boundaries for how people view contemporary women in Hip Hop. Yes, MC Lyte, Queen L, etc. had proven to be lyrically solid as well as have depth and subject matter, but no one perfected their craft more than Lauryn Hill. It's a standard of how great female artists CAN be and it opened up an alternative to the objectifiable lane that Kim, Foxy, Trina, etc. embody.

    That's impact versus influence.

    This is all subjective. Like what was already alluded to in here before, Missy was the anti-thesis to Kim, Foxy, Trina and the like...before Lauryn was. By giving Lauryn credit for pushing artistry to the forefront, you're completely ignoring what Missy did in 1997...where she successfully combined rapping, singing, producing, and writing...before Lauryn did.

    If a car stops on the highway, and another car hits it, then another, and another...and the chain reaction continues. You can't just pick the 2nd car, for example, and say that is what caused the accident. Using your logic, it would be Missy that changed the overall landscape of hip hop, in which female rappers INCLUDING Lauryn, were all able to follow.

    Give credit where credit is due, faggot.
    Flag • Wack Feelings Nosign Cosign Ether GOAT LOL •
  • I'm THAT guy...I'm THAT guy... Posts: 2,541
    Nobody's perfect reminded me of when Missy had the game on lock, doing what a lot of artist are doing today

    one of my favorite songs, I think it's time Missy gets the credit she deserves for her innovation in hip hop and female rap too

    Missy>>>>>>>>>

    But back to the thread Miseducation is more important to Hip-Hop as a whole, I feel Hardcore did more as far as females rapping and keeping it just as gully as the men did plus it pushed "sex rap" to the front of the game for females
    Flag • Wack Feelings Nosign Cosign Ether GOAT LOL •
  • Pun1sherPun1sher Posts: 424
    I'm THAT guy... wrote: »
    Nobody's perfect reminded me of when Missy had the game on lock, doing what a lot of artist are doing today

    one of my favorite songs, I think it's time Missy gets the credit she deserves for her innovation in hip hop and female rap too

    Missy>>>>>>>>>

    But back to the thread Miseducation is more important to Hip-Hop as a whole, I feel Hardcore did more as far as females rapping and keeping it just as gully as the men did plus it pushed "sex rap" to the front of the game for females

    Missy was the first female rapper to defy the odds, and be successful while NOT conforming to the formula that made Kim and Foxy successful. So she definitely deserves credit for breaking down THOSE doors.

    Maybe I should have made this thread "Supa Dupa Fly vs. The Miseducation." But, niggas would still choose Lauryn's album because they're a bunch of bandwagon sheep, with no minds of their own and does everything the media tells them to do.
    Flag • Wack Feelings Nosign Cosign Ether GOAT LOL •
  • soul rattlersoul rattler Posts: 10,144
    Pun1sher wrote: »
    This is all subjective. Like what was already alluded to in here before, Missy was the anti-thesis to Kim, Foxy, Trina and the like...before Lauryn was. By giving Lauryn credit for pushing artistry to the forefront, you're completely ignoring what Missy did in 1997...where she successfully combined rapping, singing, producing, and writing...before Lauryn did.

    If a car stops on the highway, and another car hits it, then another, and another...and the chain reaction continues. You can't just pick the 2nd car, for example, and say that is what caused the accident. Using your logic, it would be Missy that changed the overall landscape of hip hop, in which female rappers INCLUDING Lauryn, were all able to follow.

    Give credit where credit is due, faggot.

    lol @ Missy being the opposite of Kim and Foxy. Take a good look at the average Missy Elliot rap verse and she's on the same shit they were on, only she's not as attractive. Missy was the original Nicki Minaj. Get your mind right fool
    Flag • Wack Feelings Nosign Cosign Ether GOAT LOL •
  • Pun1sherPun1sher Posts: 424
    soul rattler wrote: »
    lol @ Missy being the opposite of Kim and Foxy. Take a good look at the average Missy Elliot rap verse and she's on the same shit they were on, only she's not as attractive. Missy was the original Nicki Minaj. Get your mind right fool

    Oh, okay. So Missy has never shown what hip-hop can and should be and how it should be viewed in an artistic environment? ...the same shit that you're subconsciously giving LaurMAN credit for?

    Fag, when are you going to DIE?
    Flag • Wack Feelings Nosign Cosign Ether GOAT LOL •
  • soul rattlersoul rattler Posts: 10,144
    Pun1sher wrote: »
    Oh, okay. So Missy has never shown what hip-hop can and should be and how it should be viewed in an artistic environment? ...the same shit that you're subconsciously giving LaurMAN credit for?

    Fag, when are you going to DIE?

    Missy's wasn't MORE artistic than Kim and Foxy's... it was just different. Lauryn Hill on the the other hand was on another level. Content wise it's not even close.

    lol @ artistic enviroment. Music is art you dumbass
    Flag • Wack Feelings Nosign Cosign Ether GOAT LOL •
Sign In or Register to comment.