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Why are muslims so quick to 🤬 anyone who insults muhammad?

TX_Made713
TX_Made713 Members Posts: 3,954 ✭✭
edited April 2010 in R & R (Religion and Race)
wtf is up with that? religious will always get made fun of, they are the only group who takes it too far
«13

Comments

  • ThaChozenWun
    ThaChozenWun Members Posts: 9,390
    edited April 2010
    Lol wouldn't you be mad all the time if you followed a child molestor and people brought it up?
  • husnain1
    husnain1 Members Posts: 87
    edited April 2010
    I see the ignorant still have free reign on this forum
  • explicitx
    explicitx Members Posts: 88
    edited April 2010
    husnain1 wrote: »
    I see the ignorant still have free reign on this forum

    OP is speaking the truth. Muslims (not all, just the extremists who are willing to blow up the world in the name of Allah) just need to 🤬 and the world will be a better place.
  • damnkp
    damnkp Members Posts: 1,824 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited April 2010
    i respect Muslims for not lettin anybody 🤬 with something they will die for..as opposed to Christians who let 🤬 like Jay z shiit on Jesus and still buy his albums.
  • ThaChozenWun
    ThaChozenWun Members Posts: 9,390
    edited April 2010
    damnkp wrote: »
    i respect Muslims for not lettin anybody 🤬 with something they will die for..as opposed to Christians who let 🤬 like Jay z shiit on Jesus and still buy his albums.

    Do you 🤬 people who insult Santa Claus or the Easter Bunny? I think not so why should people 🤬 for a child molestor or jesus
  • KLICHE
    KLICHE Members Posts: 5,061 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited April 2010
    explicitx wrote: »
    OP is speaking the truth. Muslims (not all, just the extremists who are willing to blow up the world in the name of Allah) just need to 🤬 and the world will be a better place.

    true.

    people need to realise the fanatics are in every religious group. And the way the threadstarter comes off is like labeling the entire people of that faith.. a minority are nutters.. the rest yeah are peaceful and just want to be left alone as much as the next person of another faith.
  • husnain1
    husnain1 Members Posts: 87
    edited April 2010
    Do you 🤬 people who insult Santa Claus or the Easter Bunny? I think not so why should people 🤬 for a child molestor or jesus

    really? why is it that people who don't know ANYTHING about islam love making blanket statements on the religion?
  • ThaChozenWun
    ThaChozenWun Members Posts: 9,390
    edited April 2010
    husnain1 wrote: »
    really? why is it that people who don't know ANYTHING about islam love making blanket statements on the religion?

    muhammad 🤬 a 10 year old, thats not child molestation? lol come on son
  • unspoken_respect
    unspoken_respect I will go where there's no path and leave behind a trail. TampaMembers Posts: 9,821 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited April 2010
    damnkp wrote: »
    i respect Muslims for not lettin anybody 🤬 with something they will die for..as opposed to Christians who let 🤬 like Jay z shiit on Jesus and still buy his albums.

    True

    But Christians have done just as much evil 🤬 .
  • theillestrator
    theillestrator Members Posts: 1,085 ✭✭
    edited April 2010
    i don't respect anyone who will die for nonsense...christianity, islam, or whatever it is.
  • And Step
    And Step Members Posts: 3,726 ✭✭✭
    edited April 2010
    TX_Made713 wrote: »
    wtf is up with that? religious will always get made fun of, they are the only group who takes it too far

    Why are all your threads antagonizing people of faith tradition? Why can't you ask an intelligent question for once?

    Just because you didn't have the equipment to defend what you believe and KTULU had you having a nervous break down online, doesn't mean you have to retaliate against every religious belief for your poor showing.

    And looking at it objectively, a 🤬 like yourself couldn't insult Buddha, Jesus, Muhammad, Zoraster , Moses, or anybody of that stature. They have an effect beyond the grave. If you leave all emotion out, Muhammad is arguably the most successful and influential man who ever lived. While you are just some two bit 🤬 who continuously gets 🤬 slapped and left for dead.

    Your the patron saint of 🤬 who take L's
  • And Step
    And Step Members Posts: 3,726 ✭✭✭
    edited April 2010
    Lol wouldn't you be mad all the time if you followed a child molestor and people brought it up?

    Right. And all the founding fathers you always big up and extol the legacy they left didn't 🤬 slaves and 🤬 little boys and girlss while simultaneously use them as bed warmers.

    Hypocrisy, chief.
  • husnain1
    husnain1 Members Posts: 87
    edited April 2010
    muhammad 🤬 a 10 year old, thats not child molestation? lol come on son


    you just proved my point. all you're doing is repeating the ignorance of others. without googling anything can you tell me who related this hadith? for that matter do you even know what a hadith is (again without having to google it)?
  • ThaChozenWun
    ThaChozenWun Members Posts: 9,390
    edited April 2010
    And Step wrote: »
    Right. And all the founding fathers you always big up and extol the legacy they left didn't 🤬 slaves and 🤬 little boys and girlss while simultaneously use them as bed warmers.

    Hypocrisy, chief.

    Lol who did I big up? I set the concept of America is golden and that Washington and them had a good view of what a true country should be, I never said I didnt have issues with what they did or personal beliefs. So judgmental toward me and always wrong.
  • ThaChozenWun
    ThaChozenWun Members Posts: 9,390
    edited April 2010
    husnain1 wrote: »
    you just proved my point. all you're doing is repeating the ignorance of others. without googling anything can you tell me who related this hadith? for that matter do you even know what a hadith is (again without having to google it)?

    Did Muhammad 🤬 the lil girl or not? Yes he did, I wasnt lying, as for the whole Islam 🤬 im still studying it, so no I cant really answer your questions. What I said is true though and written. If a thread starter would ask a question about something I didnt have any truth for I wouldnt answer.

    Are you a muslim? If your offended to the extreme come 🤬 me if I disrespected you that bad. You need my address to come get me pm me ill give it to you.
  • janklow
    janklow god's lonely man. Members, Moderators Posts: 8,613 Regulator
    edited April 2010
    damnkp wrote: »
    i respect Muslims for not lettin anybody 🤬 with something they will die for..as opposed to Christians who let 🤬 like Jay z shiit on Jesus and still buy his albums.
    on the other hand, random Muslims keep Viacom messing around with episodes of South Park, and that's just flat-out annoying
  • husnain1
    husnain1 Members Posts: 87
    edited April 2010
    Did Muhammad 🤬 the lil girl or not? Yes he did, I wasnt lying, as for the whole Islam 🤬 im still studying it, so no I cant really answer your questions. What I said is true though and written. If a thread starter would ask a question about something I didnt have any truth for I wouldnt answer.

    Are you a muslim? If your offended to the extreme come 🤬 me if I disrespected you that bad. You need my address to come get me pm me ill give it to you.

    Maybe you're not too big on subtlety but I am OBVIOUSLY implying the Prophet (pbuh) didn do such a thingt. Stating something "loud" enough doesn't make it true. And yes I am muslim and no I don't need to harm you in anyway your ignorance is already a significant hurdle in your advancement as a mature human being who can have an intelligent conversation. You clearly stated you're still studying islam and if you truly were wouldn't you hold off judgment until you had an ample grasp on the religion you are so eager to malign?
  • jay83
    jay83 Members Posts: 5,490 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited April 2010
    And Step wrote: »
    Why are all your threads antagonizing people of faith tradition? Why can't you ask an intelligent question for once?

    Just because you didn't have the equipment to defend what you believe and KTULU had you having a nervous break down online, doesn't mean you have to retaliate against every religious belief for your poor showing.

    And looking at it objectively, a 🤬 like yourself couldn't insult Buddha, Jesus, Muhammad, Zoraster , Moses, or anybody of that stature. They have an effect beyond the grave. If you leave all emotion out, Muhammad is arguably the most successful and influential man who ever lived. While you are just some two bit 🤬 who continuously gets 🤬 slapped and left for dead.

    Your the patron saint of 🤬 who take L's



    lol. I guess somebody had to say it.
  • ThaChozenWun
    ThaChozenWun Members Posts: 9,390
    edited April 2010
    husnain1 wrote: »
    Maybe you're not too big on subtlety but I am OBVIOUSLY implying the Prophet (pbuh) didn do such a thingt. Stating something "loud" enough doesn't make it true. And yes I am muslim and no I don't need to harm you in anyway your ignorance is already a significant hurdle in your advancement as a mature human being who can have an intelligent conversation. You clearly stated you're still studying islam and if you truly were wouldn't you hold off judgment until you had an ample grasp on the religion you are so eager to malign?

    Ive studied enough to know that Muhammad had sexual relations with very young girls, I understand why you dont want to acknowledge it though.
  • ThaChozenWun
    ThaChozenWun Members Posts: 9,390
    edited April 2010
    'A'isha reported that Allah's Apostle married her when she was seven years old, and he was taken to his house AS A BRIDE WHEN SHE WAS NINE, AND HER DOLLS WERE WITH HER; and when he (the Holy Prophet) died she was eighteen years old. (Sahih Muslim, Book 008, Number 3311)

    'A'isha reported that she used to PLAY WITH DOLLS in the presence of Allah's Messenger and when her playmates came to her they left (the house) because they felt shy of Allah's Messenger whereas Allah's Messenger sent them to her. (Sahih Muslim, Book 031, Number 5981)

    When the Apostle of Allah arrived after the expedition to Tabuk or Khaybar (the narrator is doubtful), the draught raised an end of a curtain which was hung in front of her store-room, revealing some dolls which belonged to her.

    He asked: What is this? She replied: My dolls. Among them he saw a horse with wings made of rags, and asked: What is this I see among them? She replied: A horse. He asked: What is this that it has on it? She replied: Two wings. He asked: A horse with two wings? She replied: Have you not heard that Solomon had horses with wings? She said: Thereupon the Apostle of Allah laughed so heartily that I could see his molar teeth. (Sunan Abu Dawud, Book 41, Number 4914)
  • husnain1
    husnain1 Members Posts: 87
    edited April 2010
    janklow wrote: »
    on the other hand, random Muslims keep Viacom messing around with episodes of South Park, and that's just flat-out annoying

    why is it so hard for people to understand that Muslims don't tolerate the denigration of our Prophet (pbuh) or that of any other Prophet. There is such a thing as free speech however, why use it so callously? You can't live in a pluralistic society and expect everyone else to hold the same views you do. What is so wrong with respecting other's beliefs? Hatred only breeds more hatred
  • ThaChozenWun
    ThaChozenWun Members Posts: 9,390
    edited April 2010
    husnain1 wrote: »
    why is it so hard for people to understand that Muslims don't tolerate the denigration of our Prophet (pbuh) or that of any other Prophet. There is such a thing as free speech however, why use it so callously? You can't live in a pluralistic society and expect everyone else to hold the same views you do. What is so wrong with respecting other's beliefs? Hatred only breeds more hatred

    So you want people to respect your views and not speak bad upon your prophets because you believe they are real, but those who dont believe in all the religious non-sense are to hold their tounges about what they percieve is real?
  • husnain1
    husnain1 Members Posts: 87
    edited April 2010
    Age of Aisha at time of marriage with Holy Prophet Muhammad

    It is believed on the authority of some Hadith reports that the marriage ceremony (known as nikah, amounting to betrothal) of Aisha with the Holy Prophet Muhammad took place when she was six years of age, and that she joined the Holy Prophet as his wife three years later at the age of nine. We quote below from two such reports in Bukhari.

    “It is reported from Aisha that she said: The Prophet entered into marriage with me when I was a girl of six … and at the time [of joining his household] I was a girl of nine years of age.”

    “Khadija died three years before the Prophet departed to Medina. He stayed [alone] for two years or so. He married Aisha when she was a girl of six years of age, and he consummated that marriage when she was nine years old.” [3]

    As to the authenticity of these reports, it may be noted that the compilers of the books of Hadith did not apply the same stringent tests when accepting reports relating to historical matters as they did before accepting reports relating to the practical teachings and laws of Islam. The reason is that the former type of report was regarded as merely of academic interest while the latter type of report had a direct bearing on the practical duties of a Muslim and on what was allowed to them and what was prohibited. Thus the occurrence of reports such as the above about the marriage of Aisha in books of Hadith, even in Bukhari, is not necessarily a proof of their credibility.

    Determination of the true age of Aisha

    It appears that Maulana Muhammad Ali was the first Islamic scholar directly to challenge the notion that Aisha was aged six and nine, respectively, at the time of her nikah and consummation of marriage. This he did in, at least, the following writings: his English booklet Prophet of Islam, his larger English book Muhammad, the Prophet, and in the footnotes in his voluminous Urdu translation and commentary of Sahih Bukhari entitled Fadl-ul-Bari, these three writings being published in the 1920s and 1930s. In the booklet Prophet of Islam, which was later incorporated in 1948 as the first chapter of his book Living Thoughts of the Prophet Muhammad, he writes in a lengthy footnote as follows:

    “A great misconception prevails as to the age at which Aisha was taken in marriage by the Prophet. Ibn Sa‘d has stated in the Tabaqat that when Abu Bakr [father of Aisha] was approached on behalf of the Holy Prophet, he replied that the girl had already been betrothed to Jubair, and that he would have to settle the matter first with him. This shows that Aisha must have been approaching majority at the time. Again, the Isaba, speaking of the Prophet’s daughter Fatima, says that she was born five years before the Call and was about five years older than Aisha. This shows that Aisha must have been about ten years at the time of her betrothal to the Prophet, and not six years as she is generally supposed to be. This is further borne out by the fact that Aisha herself is reported to have stated that when the chapter [of the Holy Quran] entitled The Moon, the fifty-fourth chapter, was revealed, she was a girl playing about and remembered certain verses then revealed. Now the fifty-fourth chapter was undoubtedly revealed before the sixth year of the Call. All these considerations point to but one conclusion, viz., that Aisha could not have been less than ten years of age at the time of her nikah, which was virtually only a betrothal. And there is one report in the Tabaqat that Aisha was nine years of age at the time of nikah. Again it is a fact admitted on all hands that the nikah of Aisha took place in the tenth year of the Call in the month of Shawwal, while there is also preponderance of evidence as to the consummation of her marriage taking place in the second year of Hijra in the same month, which shows that full five years had elapsed between the nikah and the consummation. Hence there is not the least doubt that Aisha was at least nine or ten years of age at the time of betrothal, and fourteen or fifteen years at the time of marriage.” [4] (Bolding is mine.)

    To facilitate understanding dates of these events, please note that it was in the tenth year of the Call, i.e. the tenth year after the Holy Prophet Muhammad received his calling from 🤬 to his mission of prophethood, that his wife Khadija passed away, and the approach was made to Abu Bakr for the hand of his daughter Aisha. The hijra or emigration of the Holy Prophet to Madina took place three years later, and Aisha came to the household of the Holy Prophet in the second year after hijra. So if Aisha was born in the year of the Call, she would be ten years old at the time of the nikah and fifteen years old at the time of the consummation of the marriage.

    Later research

    Research subsequent to the time of Maulana Muhammad Ali has shown that she was older than this. An excellent short work presenting such evidence is the Urdu pamphlet Rukhsati kai waqt Sayyida Aisha Siddiqa ki umar (‘The age of Lady Aisha at the time of the start of her married life’) by Abu Tahir Irfani.[4a] Points 1 to 3 below have been brought to light in this pamphlet.

    1. The famous classical historian of Islam, Ibn Jarir Tabari, wrote in his ‘History’:

    “In the time before Islam, Abu Bakr married two women. The first was Fatila daughter of Abdul Uzza, from whom Abdullah and Asma were born. Then he married Umm Ruman, from whom Abdur Rahman and Aisha were born. These four were born before Islam.” [5]

    Being born before Islam means being born before the Call.

    2. The compiler of the famous Hadith collection Mishkat al-Masabih, Imam Wali-ud-Din Muhammad ibn Abdullah Al-Khatib, who died 700 years ago, has also written brief biographical notes on the narrators of Hadith reports. He writes under Asma, the older daughter of Abu Bakr:

    “She was the sister of Aisha Siddiqa, wife of the Holy Prophet, and was ten years older than her. … In 73 A.H. … Asma died at the age of one hundred years.” [6]

    (Go here to see an image of the full entry in Urdu.)

    This would make Asma 28 years of age in 1 A.H., the year of the Hijra, thus making Aisha 18 years old in 1 A.H. So Aisha would be 19 years old at the time of the consummation of her marriage, and 14 or 15 years old at the time of her nikah. It would place her year of birth at four or five years before the Call.

    3. The same statement is made by the famous classical commentator of the Holy Quran, Ibn Kathir, in his book Al-bidayya wal-nihaya:

    “Asma died in 73 A.H. at the age of one hundred years. She was ten years older than her sister Aisha.” [7]

    Apart from these three evidences, which are presented in the Urdu pamphlet referred to above, we also note that the birth of Aisha being a little before the Call is consistent with the opening words of a statement by her which is recorded four times in Bukhari. Those words are as follows:

    “Ever since I can remember (or understand things) my parents were following the religion of Islam.” [8]

    This is tantamount to saying that she was born sometime before her parents accepted Islam but she can only remember them practising Islam. No doubt she and her parents knew well whether she was born before or after they accepted Islam, as their acceptance of Islam was such a landmark event in their life which took place just after the Holy Prophet received his mission from 🤬 . If she had been born after they accepted Islam it would make no sense for her to say that she always remembered them as following Islam. Only if she was born before they accepted Islam, would it make sense for her to say that she can only remember them being Muslims, as she was too young to remember things before their conversion. This is consistent with her being born before the Call, and being perhaps four or five years old at the time of the Call, which was also almost the time when her parents accepted Islam.

    Two further evidences cited by Maulana Muhammad Ali

    In the footnotes of his Urdu translation and commentary of Sahih Bukhari, entitled Fadl-ul-Bari, Maulana Muhammad Ali had pointed out reports of two events which show that Aisha could not have been born later than the year of the Call. These are as follows.

    1. The above mentioned statement by Aisha in Bukhari, about her earliest memory of her parents being that they were followers of Islam, begins with the following words in its version in Bukhari’s Kitab-ul-Kafalat. We quote this from the English translation of Bukhari by M. Muhsin Khan:

    “Since I reached the age when I could remember things, I have seen my parents worshipping according to the right faith of Islam. Not a single day passed but Allah’s Apostle visited us both in the morning and in the evening. When the Muslims were persecuted, Abu Bakr set out for Ethiopia as an emigrant.” [9]

    Commenting on this report, Maulana Muhammad Ali writes:

    “This report sheds some light on the question of the age of Aisha. … The mention of the persecution of Muslims along with the emigration to Ethiopia clearly shows that this refers to the fifth or the sixth year of the Call. … At that time Aisha was of an age to discern things, and so her birth could not have been later than the first year of the Call.” [10]

    Again, this would make her more than fourteen at the time of the consummation of her marriage.

    2. There is a report in Sahih Bukhari as follows:

    “On the day (of the battle) of Uhud when (some) people retreated and left the Prophet, I saw Aisha daughter of Abu Bakr and Umm Sulaim, with their robes tucked up so that the bangles around their ankles were visible hurrying with their water skins (in another narration it is said, ‘carrying the water skins on their backs’). Then they would pour the water in the mouths of the people, and return to fill the water skins again and came back again to pour water in the mouths of the people.” [11]
  • husnain1
    husnain1 Members Posts: 87
    edited April 2010
    (cont'd)

    Maulana Muhammad Ali writes in a footnote under this report:

    “It should also be noted that Aisha joined the Holy Prophet’s household only one year before the battle of Uhud. According to the common view she would be only ten years of age at this time, which is certainly not a suitable age for the work she did on this occasion. This also shows that she was not so young at this time.” [12]

    If, as shown in the previous section above, Aisha was nineteen at the time of the consummation of her marriage, then she would be twenty years old at the time of the battle of Uhud. It may be added that on the earlier occasion of the battle of Badr when some Muslim youths tried, out of eagerness, to go along with the Muslim army to the field of battle, the Holy Prophet Muhammad sent them back on account of their young age (allowing only one such youngster, Umair ibn Abi Waqqas, to accompany his older brother the famous Companion Sa‘d ibn Abi Waqqas). It seems, therefore, highly unlikely that if Aisha was ten years old the Holy Prophet would have allowed her to accompany the army to the field of battle.

    We conclude from all the evidence cited above that Aisha (may Allah be pleased with her) was nineteen years old when she joined the Holy Prophet as his wife in the year 2 A.H., the nikah or betrothal having taken place five years previously.
  • ThaChozenWun
    ThaChozenWun Members Posts: 9,390
    edited April 2010
    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
    That didnt prove she wasnt, it gave evidence to support its fact just as other people have to support the claim that she was younger. There is nothing in either case to acually prove the other wrong.

    Being that marriage and sex with girls prior to puberty was common in ancient times, I believe it. You dont want a negative image of Muhammad because thats your religion so you pick the other side.
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