What's up everyone. We are doing a contest with T.I. and we are giving away $1200 a day for the next 10 days. Just wanted to give you all a heads up.
https://www.allhiphop.com/ti

Is Christianity The Filthiest and Bloodiest Religion....a christian's resposne.

SL8Rok
SL8Rok Members Posts: 154
edited June 2010 in R & R (Religion and Race)
After reading the above mentioned thread I would have to say....LOL!!! I've seen some ignorant christian bashing in my time (and as a former atheist I sadly took part in some of it) but this I would have to say just takes the cake. I will attempt to address and destroy these pathetic assertions set forth in this thread.

1. The Bible - H-rap waste no time launching into an attack on the bible by saying its full of "murder, war, 🤬 , animal-sacrifice, human carnage, murder in the name of 🤬 and 🤬 being an angry killer", and while this argument isn't entirely untrue it is entirely obtuse. The bible does have murder, 🤬 and so forth however the bible is a book of history and seeing as how these things took place the bible surely would have to include those things. Yes there is 🤬 in the bible however its not condoned. Murder is in the bible..but it is not condoned. 🤬 and so on is in the bible but it isn't condoned. Animal sacrifice is in the bible however why would it be wrong to do so if 🤬 Himself is commanding the Israelites to do so? Simply because our 20th-21st century sensibilities say its not right? There is human carnage in the bible like the slaughter of the Amalekites and Midianites, however we must understand 🤬 's relationship to Israel at this time. Israel was for all intents and purposes the first and only theocracy where 🤬 personally ruled Israel. That being said 🤬 could and did use Israel to exercise His judgment on other nations. 🤬 also used His own power to exercise His judgment on other nations (and Israel as well), which is his divine prerogative. As far as 🤬 being an angry killer why is it hard for people to believe that 🤬 can be angry and that 🤬 would 🤬 . 🤬 gave life in the first place.

2. Next H-Rap attacks the common portrayal of Jesus as being a white, blonde hair, blue eyed man. This my friend is something that came about as a result of the catholic church and has nothing at all to do with the bible. Jesus' skin color is not even mentioned in scripture (please don't give me that feet of brass, hair of wool non-sense). Later on H-Rap comments that Jesus could do magic tricks but not save His own skin and 🤬 The Father left him there hanging. Read John 3:16, Jesus wasn't there to save himself, he was there to save you and I.

3. Now to make thing better H-Rap gives us the tired old zeitgeist argument which states that the Trinity is nothing more than a rehashing of the Egyptian Isis, Horus and Osiris and that Jesus is Horus. Nothing could be further from the truth for the reasons listed below

i. Isis, Horus and Osiris had a distinct beginning, The Father, Son and Holy Spirit do not. Jesus did come into being on earth however before that time Jesus always existed as part of the triune 🤬 .

ii. Isis, Horus and Osiris were not 3 gods in one but rather 3 separate gods with separate worship along with the rest of the egyptian pantheon. Isis, Horus and Osiris could better be described as a triad not a trinity.

iii. Horus was NOT a 🤬 birth. Isis reconstructed the body of Osiris and fashioned a 🤬 out of gold and then had sex with it and became impregnated. In another story Isis transformed herself into a sparrow and took in the essence (🤬 ) of Osiris.

4. And of course no anti-christian blathering thread could be complete without referring to Constantine and the famous council of nicea. Let us understand what the council of nicea was. It was a council to address the heresy known as Arianism. Arius was a man who said that Jesus was not co-equal with 🤬 the father. And during the whole 2 month affair scripture was read and debated notably John 14:28 and Colossians 1:15, NOT canonized. The Muratorian fragment (170Ad) is the oldest known list of scriptural canon a whopping 155 years BEFORE the council of nicea in 325 ad.

getting late part 2 coming after I get some rest.
«1

Comments

  • Rock_Well
    Rock_Well Members Posts: 2,185 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited May 2010
    get em! lol.

    welcome back blue
  • The True Flesh
    The True Flesh Members Posts: 466 ✭✭✭
    edited May 2010
    Now that's refreshing.......


    Yeah, the poeple who recycle that old rhetoric in an attempt to antagonize believers really only show that they dont have the capacity for analytical thought.

    They try to critique The Creator within the confines of human understanding and reason.......how silly !


    and what's worse is how they seek validation from the co-sign of other non-believers in such meaningles fashion, it's pathetic.


    Hast thou not known? hast thou not heard, that the everlasting 🤬 , the LORD, the Creator of the ends of the earth, fainteth not, neither is weary? there is no searching of his understanding. Isaiah 40:28




    PEACE
  • SL8Rok
    SL8Rok Members Posts: 154
    edited May 2010
    Prt 2

    5. As this total load of tripe hits its mid stride we see H-Rap layout some impressive numbers of people who died at the altar of christianity. Some key events listed are

    🤬 schism, Carthaginian struggle, Saracen slaughters in Spain,Crusades,Saxons and Scandinavians lost their lives in opposing the introduction of the blessings of Christianity, Holy(?) Wars against the Netherlands, Albigenses, Waldenses, and Huguenots, Mexicans and Peruvians were slaughtered ere they could be convinced of the beauties(?) of the Christian creed and the killing of witches.

    This of course follows along with the atypical atheist and in general anti-christian chest nut that there is no difference between christianity and catholicism, for if either group admitted this most if not all of their suppositions would fall off at the bone. For example he mentions the persecution of the Waldenses and Albigenses was committed BY the catholic church, the Crusades was a Vatican land grab, the inquisitions was a vatican operation to eliminate christians who would not bow to the rule of the Pope. Now have people done things wicked in the name of Jesus, yes, but does Jesus in the bible condone killing or anything of the sort, no. People seem to figure that wars and such take place because of various and complex reasons and in all cases the ruling class needs to get the people on board to support the war, and people will use whatever reason to justify it. Religion or not there will be people to prey upon the beliefs of others to gain support for their wicked ideas.

    6. As for "the bible was used to justify slavery bit" I submit that while yes PARTS of the bible were used to justify slavery OTHER parts of the bible had to have been ignored to do so. Such as

    Exodus 21:16 - And he that stealeth a man, and selleth him, or if he be found in his hand, he shall surely be put to death.

    or

    Exodus 22:21 - Thou shalt neither vex a stranger, nor oppress him: for ye were strangers in the land of Egypt.

    if the whole bible was used to justify slavery every slave trader or person who bought african slaved would have to be put to death.

    You are correct in saying the Hamatic myth, its not in the bible and therefore it is something that was made up purely for the purpose of mentally enslaving africans. The curse of ham is not even biblical and you even admit that, so what exactly is the point of you mentioning it. And why mention white jews using the bible, isn't this about christianity? The bible has and can be used to justify anything if you take it out of context and add in your own spin. That saying nothing about christianity or the bible itself but the wicked intentions of men.

    Christian missionaries have gone the world over and helped ease the suffering of millions of people, however I guess it would be too much to ask for some balanced reporting of the facts.

    7. H-Rap then continues the hate fest by stating

    Christianity breeds authoritarianism
    Christianity is anti-intellectual, anti-scientific
    Christianity has a morbid, unhealthy preoccupation with sex
    Christianity encourages acceptance of real evils while focusing on imaginary evils.
    Christianity models hierarchical, authoritarian organization
    Christianity is misogynistic
    Christianity is homophobic
    The Bible is not a reliable guide to Christ’s teachings
    The Bible, Christianity’s basic text, is riddled with contradictions

    however I retort

    1. Christianity doesn't breed authoritarianism, the USSR and Red China two of the most atheist regimes were highly authoritarian.
    2. If christianity is anti-scientific/anti-intellectual why were most of the early scientist (like Isaac Newton) christian?
    3. How does christianity have a preoccupation with sex?
    4. Which real evils are christians forced to accept?
    5. Care to elaborate how christianity does this?
    6. Which is why the first Judge of Israel (they had judges before they had kings) was a woman?
    7. Simply because we assert homosexuality is a sin doesn't mean we are afraid of 🤬 .
    8. How is the bible not reliable as a guide to Christ teachings
    9. I'd like to see one contradiction in the bible.

    8. I will sum up my objection to the rest of this pathetic little thread by saying, simply because these people claimed to be christian doesn't mean they are. Simply because people claim to do things in the name of a said religion doesn't mean that religion supports those ideas. Stalin and Mao were both atheist who killed many millions of people yet following the logic of atheist it that would mean atheism is a 🤬 and wicked belief system.
  • hrap-120
    hrap-120 Members Posts: 9,449 ✭✭✭
    edited May 2010
    Awesome, makes me wanna go to church. (if i can find a babysitter...scared to bring my kiddies around the preists) :(

    Abrahamic political-cult follower.

    Weak people always put faith in th
    e unknown...worshipping a mystery 🤬 , performing primitive cannibal-body-of-christ-rituals and just being soulless empty vessels of dogma, superstition, and foolish beliefs.

    Xristianity is garbage to me, a bunch of hypocrites and wacko's...

    I respect eastern religions, I admire the wisdom in the Gita and Hiduism's morality and karma themes, seems like a peaceful religion...never heard of Hindu's burning witches.

    I respect Buddhists, the meditation, their philosophy, and the quest for enlightenment, it seems like a peaceful and noble religion...hard to infuse racism in there theology

    I respect Taoists, Jehovas Witnesses, and even Agnostic's but I have no respect for the Pope and his minions.
  • Chike
    Chike Members Posts: 2,702 ✭✭✭
    edited May 2010
    Ok then how do you explain the priests that molest and 🤬 boys? And if they are evil, does this mean everyone that has ever listened to them preach as a credible source of '🤬 ' has to now rethink their whole belief pattern? lol How can you take anything someone says about 🤬 seriously when they are running around 🤬 children?
  • Fazeem_Blackall
    Fazeem_Blackall Members Posts: 4,216 ✭✭
    edited May 2010
    There is no difference between catholic and protestants, they all conducted inquisitions even hear in the americas, Politics caused the rift everything else was subterfuge to try and rationalize and muster support for each side...
  • melanated khemist
    melanated khemist Members Posts: 608 ✭✭✭
    edited May 2010
    SL8Rok wrote: »
    After reading the above mentioned thread I would have to say....LOL!!! I've seen some ignorant christian bashing in my time (and as a former atheist I sadly took part in some of it) but this I would have to say just takes the cake. I will attempt to address and destroy these pathetic assertions set forth in this thread.

    1. The Bible - H-rap waste no time launching into an attack on the bible by saying its full of "murder, war, 🤬 , animal-sacrifice, human carnage, murder in the name of 🤬 and 🤬 being an angry killer", and while this argument isn't entirely untrue it is entirely obtuse. The bible does have murder, 🤬 and so forth however the bible is a book of history and seeing as how these things took place the bible surely would have to include those things. Yes there is 🤬 in the bible however its not condoned. Murder is in the bible..but it is not condoned. 🤬 and so on is in the bible but it isn't condoned. Animal sacrifice is in the bible however why would it be wrong to do so if 🤬 Himself is commanding the Israelites to do so? Simply because our 20th-21st century sensibilities say its not right? There is human carnage in the bible like the slaughter of the Amalekites and Midianites, however we must understand 🤬 's relationship to Israel at this time. Israel was for all intents and purposes the first and only theocracy where 🤬 personally ruled Israel. That being said 🤬 could and did use Israel to exercise His judgment on other nations. 🤬 also used His own power to exercise His judgment on other nations (and Israel as well), which is his divine prerogative. As far as 🤬 being an angry killer why is it hard for people to believe that 🤬 can be angry and that 🤬 would 🤬 . 🤬 gave life in the first place.

    2. Next H-Rap attacks the common portrayal of Jesus as being a white, blonde hair, blue eyed man. This my friend is something that came about as a result of the catholic church and has nothing at all to do with the bible. Jesus' skin color is not even mentioned in scripture (please don't give me that feet of brass, hair of wool non-sense). Later on H-Rap comments that Jesus could do magic tricks but not save His own skin and 🤬 The Father left him there hanging. Read John 3:16, Jesus wasn't there to save himself, he was there to save you and I.

    3. Now to make thing better H-Rap gives us the tired old zeitgeist argument which states that the Trinity is nothing more than a rehashing of the Egyptian Isis, Horus and Osiris and that Jesus is Horus. Nothing could be further from the truth for the reasons listed below

    i. Isis, Horus and Osiris had a distinct beginning, The Father, Son and Holy Spirit do not. Jesus did come into being on earth however before that time Jesus always existed as part of the triune 🤬 .

    ii. Isis, Horus and Osiris were not 3 gods in one but rather 3 separate gods with separate worship along with the rest of the egyptian pantheon. Isis, Horus and Osiris could better be described as a triad not a trinity.

    iii. Horus was NOT a 🤬 birth. Isis reconstructed the body of Osiris and fashioned a 🤬 out of gold and then had sex with it and became impregnated. In another story Isis transformed herself into a sparrow and took in the essence (🤬 ) of Osiris.

    4. And of course no anti-christian blathering thread could be complete without referring to Constantine and the famous council of nicea. Let us understand what the council of nicea was. It was a council to address the heresy known as Arianism. Arius was a man who said that Jesus was not co-equal with 🤬 the father. And during the whole 2 month affair scripture was read and debated notably John 14:28 and Colossians 1:15, NOT canonized. The Muratorian fragment (170Ad) is the oldest known list of scriptural canon a whopping 155 years BEFORE the council of nicea in 325 ad.

    getting late part 2 coming after I get some rest.

    this is where your wrong. learn the craft and get off that wack 🤬
  • melanated khemist
    melanated khemist Members Posts: 608 ✭✭✭
    edited May 2010
    damn near everything u posted is flawed, but hey who has time to polly with a jezus freak
  • hrap-120
    hrap-120 Members Posts: 9,449 ✭✭✭
    edited May 2010
    damn near everything u posted is flawed, but hey who has time to polly with a jezus freak
    I almost get excited when I see a minion thats conquered by religion....it means they are still sleep. :)
  • SL8Rok
    SL8Rok Members Posts: 154
    edited May 2010
    this is where your wrong. learn the craft and get off that wack 🤬

    Where am I wrong?
  • SL8Rok
    SL8Rok Members Posts: 154
    edited May 2010
    Chike wrote: »
    Ok then how do you explain the priests that molest and 🤬 boys? And if they are evil, does this mean everyone that has ever listened to them preach as a credible source of '🤬 ' has to now rethink their whole belief pattern? lol How can you take anything someone says about 🤬 seriously when they are running around 🤬 children?

    1. Easy they're not christians. The bible doesn't condone 🤬 young boys nor does it require men who are ministers of the faith (which every believer is) to not be married. That is a man made requirement added by the catholic church and has nothing to do with biblical christianity.

    2. First off if you are listening to a man preach and not going to the scripture to make sure they are correctly preaching the word then you are in error. If your faith relied entirely on that preacher, pastor, deacon, bishop or whatever then what was your faith really based on. Was it in Christ or some fallible man?

    3. My point exactly so why are people listening to them, they should read and listen to the word of 🤬 found in scripture.
  • SL8Rok
    SL8Rok Members Posts: 154
    edited May 2010
    hrap-120 wrote: »
    Awesome, makes me wanna go to church. (if i can find a babysitter...scared to bring my kiddies around the preists) :(

    Abrahamic political-cult follower.

    Weak people always put faith in th
    e unknown...worshipping a mystery 🤬 , performing primitive cannibal-body-of-christ-rituals and just being soulless empty vessels of dogma, superstition, and foolish beliefs.

    Xristianity is garbage to me, a bunch of hypocrites and wacko's...

    I respect eastern religions, I admire the wisdom in the Gita and Hiduism's morality and karma themes, seems like a peaceful religion...never heard of Hindu's burning witches.

    I respect Buddhists, the meditation, their philosophy, and the quest for enlightenment, it seems like a peaceful and noble religion...hard to infuse racism in there theology

    I respect Taoists, Jehovas Witnesses, and even Agnostic's but I have no respect for the Pope and his minions.

    1. Is christianity wack or is the image you see of christianity wack to you? Your entire arguments are based on broad generalizations, very obtuse and biased reporting of facts and little to no understanding of the fact that simply because someone who claims the title christian does something evil doesn't mean that "christianity" is evil. Your logic and rationale is that of a racist. Black people commit crimes all the time is it then fair and logical to assume that all blacks are evil and criminal in nature? No of course not.

    2. Have u ever heard of the Kfir wars in which Hindus were killing blacks. The caste system is a creation of hinduism btw. Not to mention which version of hinduism are you referring to? Hinduism is not a religion it has no central doctrine, beliefs or anything that would identify it as a religion. Its the logical conclusion of moral relativism. And not all hindus believe in karma and reincarnation. And hindus in india regurlarly persecute christians and muslims. Simply because you don't hear about it doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

    3. If people wanted to add racism or any other kind of wicked means to a religion they can and will. Buddhism and other eastern religions are no exception.

    4. So you don't like catholicism, well finally something you say that actually makes sense.
  • SL8Rok
    SL8Rok Members Posts: 154
    edited May 2010
    damn near everything u posted is flawed, but hey who has time to polly with a jezus freak

    Yep sounds like a very logical and well thought out rebuttal to my arguments.
  • melanated khemist
    melanated khemist Members Posts: 608 ✭✭✭
    edited May 2010
    SL8Rok wrote: »
    Yep sounds like a very logical and well thought out rebuttal to my arguments.

    who uses logic?
  • melanated khemist
    melanated khemist Members Posts: 608 ✭✭✭
    edited May 2010
    SL8Rok wrote: »
    1. Is christianity wack or is the image you see of christianity wack to you? Your entire arguments are based on broad generalizations, very obtuse and biased reporting of facts and little to no understanding of the fact that simply because someone who claims the title christian does something evil doesn't mean that "christianity" is evil. Your logic and rationale is that of a racist. Black people commit crimes all the time is it then fair and logical to assume that all blacks are evil and criminal in nature? No of course not.

    2. Have u ever heard of the Kfir wars in which Hindus were killing blacks. The caste system is a creation of hinduism btw. Not to mention which version of hinduism are you referring to? Hinduism is not a religion it has no central doctrine, beliefs or anything that would identify it as a religion. Its the logical conclusion of moral relativism. And not all hindus believe in karma and reincarnation. And hindus in india regurlarly persecute christians and muslims. Simply because you don't hear about it doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

    3. If people wanted to add racism or any other kind of wicked means to a religion they can and will. Buddhism and other eastern religions are no exception.

    4. So you don't like catholicism, well finally something you say that actually makes sense.

    Both. especially your europeanized version
  • And Step
    And Step Members Posts: 3,726 ✭✭✭
    edited May 2010
    As an organized European cultural/religious tool, definitely.

    Standing alone as practiced by adherants. No. Christianity and the Teachings of Jesus are not the same.

    Christianity is the name and Europeans placed upon their scholarship and view of Jesus Teaching. And any body that falls under their scholarship(Bible, Church, denominations, Rituals) falls under the dominion. We become like what we submit to.

    Jesus did not teach Christianity. Europeans co-opted his name, image, teachings and gave it to the rest of the world. They said "Here is Jesus". And we accepted because we indirectly worship white people as 🤬 . We don't even take time to think that the same people who gave you the Bible, Jesus, Christianity, are the same people who brought you over on slave ships, colonized you in africa and until this day are robbing you of your resources. They have historically shown that they don't treat you right at all, yet you trust them to tell you the truth about 🤬 ?

    No other people would accept such foolishness.

    Develop an independent study of Jesus outside of European Scholarship and then maybe we can talk. Otherwise your the slavemaster's bioootch.

    Deal with it.
  • hrap-120
    hrap-120 Members Posts: 9,449 ✭✭✭
    edited May 2010
    And Step wrote: »
    As an organized European cultural/religious tool, definitely.

    Standing alone as practiced by adherants. No. Christianity and the Teachings of Jesus are not the same.

    Christianity is the name and Europeans placed upon their scholarship and view of Jesus Teaching. And any body that falls under their scholarship(Bible, Church, denominations, Rituals) falls under the dominion. We become like what we submit to.

    Jesus did not teach Christianity. Europeans co-opted his name, image, teachings and gave it to the rest of the world. They said "Here is Jesus". And we accepted because we indirectly worship white people as 🤬 . We don't even take time to think that the same people who gave you the Bible, Jesus, Christianity, are the same people who brought you over on slave ships, colonized you in africa and until this day are robbing you of your resources. They have historically shown that they don't treat you right at all, yet you trust them to tell you the truth about 🤬 ?

    No other people would accept such foolishness.

    Develop an independent study of Jesus outside of European Scholarship and then maybe we can talk. Otherwise your the slavemaster's bioootch.

    Deal with it.
    I need you as my spokesman. Articulated perfectly.
  • melanated khemist
    melanated khemist Members Posts: 608 ✭✭✭
    edited May 2010
    hrap-120 wrote: »
    I need you as my spokesman. Articulated perfectly.

    Peace King. I agree that was well said.
  • SL8Rok
    SL8Rok Members Posts: 154
    edited May 2010
    And Step wrote: »
    As an organized European cultural/religious tool, definitely.

    Standing alone as practiced by adherants. No. Christianity and the Teachings of Jesus are not the same.

    Christianity is the name and Europeans placed upon their scholarship and view of Jesus Teaching. And any body that falls under their scholarship(Bible, Church, denominations, Rituals) falls under the dominion. We become like what we submit to.

    Jesus did not teach Christianity. Europeans co-opted his name, image, teachings and gave it to the rest of the world. They said "Here is Jesus". And we accepted because we indirectly worship white people as 🤬 . We don't even take time to think that the same people who gave you the Bible, Jesus, Christianity, are the same people who brought you over on slave ships, colonized you in africa and until this day are robbing you of your resources. They have historically shown that they don't treat you right at all, yet you trust them to tell you the truth about 🤬 ?

    No other people would accept such foolishness.

    Develop an independent study of Jesus outside of European Scholarship and then maybe we can talk. Otherwise your the slavemaster's bioootch.

    Deal with it.

    1. Christianity is actually used in the bible. In the book of Acts it was in Antioch where the christians were first called christian. Turkey while partly is in europe is mostly in the middle east/asia. So you are incorrect in saying that europeans gave christianity the name. Also if you are a chrisitan you fall under the dominion of 🤬 not man. Now agreed if you are following mans teachings ABOUT the bible and not the bible itself (which for all of your conspiratorial talk and assertations cannot and have not produced one compelling argument or shred of evidence proving that it has been tampered with or altered to suit a particular parties needs)then yes you are under man, however the bible teaches that WE are study to show ourselves approved and we should always be vigiliant that we are in the faith. Not to rely solely on what a pastor or other "man of the cloth" says. It seems to me that you and other anti-christians are attacking a false image of christianity rather than christianity itself.

    2. Now I love this argument because it asserts that christianity is different than the teachings of Jesus, however christianity is the name given to christ teachings. That would be like someone saying that Maoism (Moa's form of communism) and Mao's teachings aren't the same. Well yes they are, regardless of how they've been corrupted that only means that there is an uncorrupted version which is properly to be called Maoism. Similarly, simply because men over time have corrupted the teachings of Jesus and have spread false christianity doesn't mean that Jesus' message in the bible isn't to be properly called Christianity. Moreover it doesn't mean that men haven't kept and promoted the teachings of Jesus found in the bible (proper christianity).

    3. Europeans and man in general have taken plenty of ideas and twisted them to wicked ends that doesn't take away from the ideas validity. Evolution for example was twisted in the idea of social darwinism which taught that whites were superior and blacks and other darker skinned peoples were just lower level humans and therefore just like animals (the movie Maafa 21 goes into this in greater detail). However proponents of evolution would never ascribe such racist teachings to evolution. I agree that there are versions of "christianity" that are being taught which are wholly unbiblical. There are black versions of christianity as well as white versions of christianity that were and are used witch totally fudge the message of christ and are used to wicked ends. That however doesn't make Christianity wrong that only means that those versions of Christianity are wrong.

    4. Are you saying there were no black christians prior to slavery? The ethiopic orthodoxy and coptic christian church existed in Ethiopia and Egypt respectively were establish in the first 1-2 centuries after Christ. And europeans didn't give us the bible. The bible is a product of the near east NOT europe. Now you can again assert it was tampered with but you have not shown or proven such.

    5. How am studying Jesus within european scholarship? Many if not all the early church fathers were NOT european Moreover why should I disregard european scholarship? You should just come out and say you're a racist.
  • SL8Rok
    SL8Rok Members Posts: 154
    edited May 2010
    Both. especially your europeanized version

    How exactly is my version of christianity "europeanized"?
  • tri3w
    tri3w Members Posts: 3,142 ✭✭
    edited May 2010
    And Step wrote: »
    As an organized European cultural/religious tool, definitely.

    Standing alone as practiced by adherants. No. Christianity and the Teachings of Jesus are not the same.

    Christianity is the name and Europeans placed upon their scholarship and view of Jesus Teaching. And any body that falls under their scholarship(Bible, Church, denominations, Rituals) falls under the dominion. We become like what we submit to.

    Jesus did not teach Christianity. Europeans co-opted his name, image, teachings and gave it to the rest of the world. They said "Here is Jesus". And we accepted because we indirectly worship white people as 🤬 . We don't even take time to think that the same people who gave you the Bible, Jesus, Christianity, are the same people who brought you over on slave ships, colonized you in africa and until this day are robbing you of your resources. They have historically shown that they don't treat you right at all, yet you trust them to tell you the truth about 🤬 ?

    No other people would accept such foolishness.

    Develop an independent study of Jesus outside of European Scholarship and then maybe we can talk. Otherwise your the slavemaster's bioootch.

    Deal with it.

    Here is the Kicker though...........We had that waaaaaaaay b4 for they did............The events and the Stories in the Bible Happen in the Middle East and IN Africa.......There was Real Christian Empires in Afirca whlie Europeans were still Scafircing there Children to Pagan Gods.......if u r Refering to the Europeanized Cathloic verison, then yea U have a Point.........But For the Record, We had it b4 they did
  • Chike
    Chike Members Posts: 2,702 ✭✭✭
    edited May 2010
    SL8Rok wrote: »
    1. Easy they're not christians. The bible doesn't condone 🤬 young boys nor does it require men who are ministers of the faith (which every believer is) to not be married. That is a man made requirement added by the catholic church and has nothing to do with biblical christianity.

    2. First off if you are listening to a man preach and not going to the scripture to make sure they are correctly preaching the word then you are in error. If your faith relied entirely on that preacher, pastor, deacon, bishop or whatever then what was your faith really based on. Was it in Christ or some fallible man?

    3. My point exactly so why are people listening to them, they should read and listen to the word of 🤬 found in scripture.



    So then you agree? Going to Church is pointless? And if so, then how do you go about understanding the Bible if you cannot trust man to teach it to you? Just like the Catholic church adding nonsense to their religious system, how do you know Christianity hasn't as well? Both religions were founded by men, and both religions were used to conquer, pillage and destroy. Most child molestors, be it in Catholicism or Christianity are not going to get cought or come out and admit what they have done, so for all you know, your pastor could be all over them little choir boys and you don't have a clue.

    And, if someone just hands a boy a Bible and says, read this for yourself, what makes you think they are going to understand a word that is written within that book without someone explaining it to them. Chances are, they way they interpret it wont be the christian way.
  • SL8Rok
    SL8Rok Members Posts: 154
    edited May 2010
    Chike wrote: »
    So then you agree? Going to Church is pointless? And if so, then how do you go about understanding the Bible if you cannot trust man to teach it to you? Just like the Catholic church adding nonsense to their religious system, how do you know Christianity hasn't as well? Both religions were founded by men, and both religions were used to conquer, pillage and destroy. Most child molestors, be it in Catholicism or Christianity are not going to get cought or come out and admit what they have done, so for all you know, your pastor could be all over them little choir boys and you don't have a clue.

    And, if someone just hands a boy a Bible and says, read this for yourself, what makes you think they are going to understand a word that is written within that book without someone explaining it to them. Chances are, they way they interpret it wont be the christian way.

    1. No I do not agree going to church is pointless. I do however agree that you shouldn't be whole heartedly embracing what another man teaches you about the bible. The bible says study to show THY(Your)self approved. How do you understand the bible with no man to teach it to you, the instruction of the holy spirit. The bible isn't written in hard to understand language nor are the doctrine of christianity inaccessible by reading the bible for yourself. The bible says that the holy spirit is the only teacher you need in the word. Now men can teach the bible however this is to always be followed up by going back to scripture to read it for yourself. How do I know christianity hasn't had things added to it? Because the bible hasn't had anything added to it. The catholics have added things to their doctrine many of which are horrible errors and outright heresy (calling a man holy father!!), however the teachings of Jesus (properly called christianity) haven't been changed. Now have professing adherants used christianity to promote violence and evil. Yes of course, however anything can be used to justify anything. Evolution was used to promote the racist doctrine of social darwinism. Socialism used to promote the slaughter of people in the USSR and Red China. Would a socialist or evolutionist agree these are central tenets of their world view? Of course not. All that proves is that people will use popular beliefs and world views to promote evil. Jesus didn't even attempt to fight the men who came to take him to be tried by the Saducees and Pharisees. He didn't so much as scowl at them as they slapped him and spit in their face. As he hung on the cross beaten and 🤬 he asked 🤬 to forgive them for what they'd done. How does this in anyway logically lead you to conclude that people following this man would be killing, 🤬 , conquering and so on. The bible says the weapons of our warfare are not CARNAL (worldly) but might through the pulling down of strong holds, in plain english we aren't fighting a physical war but a spiritual war. So there is no reason for a christian to be fighting, killing or committing violence in the name of Jesus, He in fact forbids it when He says that we are to have peace with all men.

    While that could be true that any pastor could be doing anything it could also be true that my or any pastor could NOT be doing those things. There are lots of hypocrites in the organized church, I would be the first to admit this but there are many who are not. I'm not following the pastor I'm following Christ.

    What makes you think the boy wouldn't be able to read it? There is not "way" to read the bible, it says what it means and means what it says. Its only when people start writing extra things as companion guides such as treatises, tomes, "confessions of faith" (Westminster confession of faith for example) and start writing on christian doctrine do we see the many fractures within christianity.
  • And Step
    And Step Members Posts: 3,726 ✭✭✭
    edited May 2010
    tri3w wrote: »
    Here is the Kicker though...........We had that waaaaaaaay b4 for they did............The events and the Stories in the Bible Happen in the Middle East and IN Africa.......There was Real Christian Empires in Afirca whlie Europeans were still Scafircing there Children to Pagan Gods.......if u r Refering to the Europeanized Cathloic verison, then yea U have a Point.........But For the Record, We had it b4 they did

    Not in any way disputing that Tri3. My point is we let the Europeans co-opt the image, teachings, and traditions of Jesus, not just the Catholics. Protestant, Lutheran, Anglican, whatever.

    We use their translation of the book. Where is the Scriptures translated from Aramaic or Hebrew by the African or Asian? Sincerely, how can we let a British King who is responsible for the onset of greatest global hegemony the world has ever seen, be responsible for our learning the truth about Jesus?

    How can we let the Romans , who the British descend from, and the Greeks, the most warmongering, Polytheistic people the world has ever seen, now turn around and accept the Bible from their hands as sacred, when these people were on the periphery of the Holy Land?
  • And Step
    And Step Members Posts: 3,726 ✭✭✭
    edited May 2010
    SL8Rok wrote: »

    2. Now I love this argument because it asserts that christianity is different than the teachings of Jesus, however christianity is the name given to christ teachings. That would be like someone saying that Maoism (Moa's form of communism) and Mao's teachings aren't the same. Well yes they are, regardless of how they've been corrupted that only means that there is an uncorrupted version which is properly to be called Maoism. Similarly, simply because men over time have corrupted the teachings of Jesus and have spread false christianity doesn't mean that Jesus' message in the bible isn't to be properly called Christianity. Moreover it doesn't mean that men haven't kept and promoted the teachings of Jesus found in the bible (proper christianity).

    If I had a red marker I would x all that 🤬 out.

    Name given by who?

    Christian was the name given by the enemies of Jesus for his followers, not Jesus. Are you a follower of his enemies or Jesus? Jesus never taught or said he taught Christianity. How could he? Christ is a Greek word(Kristos) Jesus didn't speak Greek. The only time Jesus mentioned what he was taught by name, he called it the Way(which erroneously translators call My name). Those are names you put on your scholarship and attribute it to Jesus. Then you create division on the basis of these names among yourselves. How you going to put Jesus name on something that came from his 🤬 ? He claimed that whatever he taught, he got from his 🤬 .

    He never said he was Christian, Catholic, Baptist, Methodist, Presbyterian, Unitarian, Episcopalian, Lutheran, Adventist, JW, Protestant.

    Can Christ be divided? Isn't that what your Bible teaches you?