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The Official Floyd Mayweather is the best boxer of this era period...

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Comments

  • The Lonious Monk
    The Lonious Monk Man with No Fucks Given Members Posts: 26,258 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Mrslim1 wrote: »

    i dig that and i can agree. responding to your post you were saying things like "oh well he lost and he lost again after" which really minimizes the sport to me. but with this clarification i have no issue with your statments

    i was always a fan of the sport. i started following boxing on the week to week-fight by fight- "in the know basis" with the De La Hoya-Quartey fight. My favorites were a researched Sweet Pea, Hopkins & RJJ, Prince Naseem, Mosley & Trinidad. I had heard of & seen Floyd before liked what i saw but had not seen a full fight of his until 2003 against N'Dou which made me a fan

    So ill say that at the time of all fights made regardless of age or flaw. Every fighter after 2004 was promoted or truly believed to be the one to beat Floyd or be the one that was too much to handle and eventually, the one to "Shut His Mouth"; especially Judah,Corrales, Gatti, and Hatton. Floyd cashed out with De La Hoya & i dont blame him one bit but until 2007 Floyd always looked for the best fight,fighter and money. now it may be 2 out of 3 or some combo

    Manny is just a revved up version of the Cotto debacle with the media and an entire hemisphere on his side. If it happens it happens. I want the fight just like i wanted LeBrons ring: so we can actually get back to boxing/basketball

    Yeah, in looking back at my post, I really didn't make my argument too well.

    But to your comment about all these guys supposing to be the one that would shut his mouth. I don't even like Floyd and I'll still say that about half the people that were supposed to shut him up, everyone knew couldn't get the job done. I mean they tried to build the Ortiz fight up as a potential tough one for Floyd, but we all knew that he was going to walk all over him. I'm not saying Floyd doesn't have any good wins under his belt, but this is a weak time in boxing. That's not Floyd's fault though. It is his fault that he didn't take down Manny while Manny was still seen as an unstoppable force.

    I agree with most of what u said , but I think Manny was more built up as a unstoppable force , but the reality was totally different . Manny was a good anti Floyd and if Floyd would have beat the breaks off of him like most of us suspect he would have the win would have looked better than it actually was just because the way Manny was built up

    I don't know. I think Manny was as good as he was billed relative to the competition. I just don't think he was ever as good as Floyd. Still I do believe he represented the best challenge Floyd ever would have had and it is a blemish on both of their careers that the fight never went down.
  • Mrslim1
    Mrslim1 Members Posts: 2,614 ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2012
    Mrslim1 wrote: »

    i dig that and i can agree. responding to your post you were saying things like "oh well he lost and he lost again after" which really minimizes the sport to me. but with this clarification i have no issue with your statments

    i was always a fan of the sport. i started following boxing on the week to week-fight by fight- "in the know basis" with the De La Hoya-Quartey fight. My favorites were a researched Sweet Pea, Hopkins & RJJ, Prince Naseem, Mosley & Trinidad. I had heard of & seen Floyd before liked what i saw but had not seen a full fight of his until 2003 against N'Dou which made me a fan

    So ill say that at the time of all fights made regardless of age or flaw. Every fighter after 2004 was promoted or truly believed to be the one to beat Floyd or be the one that was too much to handle and eventually, the one to "Shut His Mouth"; especially Judah,Corrales, Gatti, and Hatton. Floyd cashed out with De La Hoya & i dont blame him one bit but until 2007 Floyd always looked for the best fight,fighter and money. now it may be 2 out of 3 or some combo

    Manny is just a revved up version of the Cotto debacle with the media and an entire hemisphere on his side. If it happens it happens. I want the fight just like i wanted LeBrons ring: so we can actually get back to boxing/basketball

    Yeah, in looking back at my post, I really didn't make my argument too well.

    But to your comment about all these guys supposing to be the one that would shut his mouth. I don't even like Floyd and I'll still say that about half the people that were supposed to shut him up, everyone knew couldn't get the job done. I mean they tried to build the Ortiz fight up as a potential tough one for Floyd, but we all knew that he was going to walk all over him. I'm not saying Floyd doesn't have any good wins under his belt, but this is a weak time in boxing. That's not Floyd's fault though. It is his fault that he didn't take down Manny while Manny was still seen as an unstoppable force.

    I agree with most of what u said , but I think Manny was more built up as a unstoppable force , but the reality was totally different . Manny was a good anti Floyd and if Floyd would have beat the breaks off of him like most of us suspect he would have the win would have looked better than it actually was just because the way Manny was built up

    I don't know. I think Manny was as good as he was billed relative to the competition. I just don't think he was ever as good as Floyd. Still I do believe he represented the best challenge Floyd ever would have had and it is a blemish on both of their careers that the fight never went down.

    I think fans lost the experince of the hype of the fight more than anything, Boxing fans deserved that , now if the fight would have been any good ? Thats a different story . But we as fans deserved the pre fight hype that would have came with them fighting it would have been epic
  • The Lonious Monk
    The Lonious Monk Man with No Fucks Given Members Posts: 26,258 ✭✭✭✭✭
    It would have been an exciting fight I think. Manny at the time was super aggressive. Now that probably would have worked against him fighting Floyd, but it would have kept the fight interesting.
  • Mrslim1
    Mrslim1 Members Posts: 2,614 ✭✭✭✭
    It would have been an exciting fight I think. Manny at the time was super aggressive. Now that probably would have worked against him fighting Floyd, but it would have kept the fight interesting.

    Yea for about 7 to 8 rounds then Floyd would have beat him bad
  • The Lonious Monk
    The Lonious Monk Man with No Fucks Given Members Posts: 26,258 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Du_Du wrote: »
    monk....


    if you're offered a job paying $40.00 a hour that looks great on your resume, is convenient for you to get to, and still challenges your best talents...

    why would you pass it up for a job that pays half the money...has absolutely no future, and is just boring as 🤬 all day long?


    floyd took the fights that made the most money, had the better recognized names, and challeged his ability every time...

    never once was their an easy fight...
    no matter how good he looked... he did not take soft touches....


    for those who dump on the oscar fight...let's not forget..split decision... and NO CATCH WEIGHT...like a lotta other fighters have consistently done...

    let's not forget how much ricky hatton called out floyd for not fighting him at 140...dude claimed floyd was ducking him, and after the way hatton knocked castilo the 🤬 out in 4 rounds... 🤬 was sying dude wa far too rough for floyd...

    you may not remember , but i remember 2007 clearly.. hatton knocked castillo the 🤬 out, a guy who fought floyd close as hell....and nigaz were adamant about hatton knocking floyd out... people went as far as to say floyd would NEVER fight hatton...

    hatton was undefeated, and just knocked one of floyd's toughest opponents the 🤬 out....let's be real here...

    and the zab fight..??

    c'mon.. you're talking to the #1 zab fan in the world.....been a zab fan since he turned pro....


    and up until the 2nd half of the fight with floyd.. i was 100% convinced zab was going to be the one to hand floyd that first lost....


    don't do it to yourself.. floyd's resume is tight.....🤬 can call the shane fight a blemish if they want.. but that 2nd round when shane had floyd rocked....everyone watching thought maybe floyd finally bit off more than he could chew

    Sorry I missed this and didn't respond.

    I don't really understand the point you were trying to make with you first argument. And I don't really see how you can say he never had an easy fight when most of his more recent fights were considered won before he even got in the ring.

    The ways that you're defending these fights doesn't even make sense. There is also a difference between Floyd haters wanting to believe someone could beat him and real boxing fans believing someone could beat him. I'm not saying no one thought cats like Hatton or Judah had a chance, but no impartial person was running around believing that Hatton was going to knock Floyd out. As a matter of fact I can remember a conversation on ESPN where they were basically saying that the Floyd fight would prove whether Hatton was the real deal or not.

    The fact of the matter is those dudes beat up on each other, and Floyd beat up on them. Manny beat up on those same guys. That's why he was a big pull for Floyd, not because of media hype. He was a big pull because he was the only person that had run through all the competition and come out unscathed. He set himself up as a natural foil to Floyd and that's why it was such a big deal that they fight.

  • aneed123
    aneed123 Members Posts: 23,763 ✭✭✭✭✭
    manny was built up off of older fighters, weight and guys floyd beat first.... Eric Morrales wanted the rematch to be at a higher weight... Arum and Manny refused.... Morrales had no legs and was falling over the rings from arm punches. Raheem beat him before Manny and no one cared calling Eric washed up. anyway Arum used Floyds name to build his fighters up. Manny was not this unstoppable force. I saw him ,lose to Morrales on just a jab and right hand. I saw JMM beat him and get robbbed arguably 3 times. I saw him duck the best at 135 and cherry pick David Diaz for a belt instead of fighting Nate Campbell, Casamayor, or JMM who had followed him up in weight. anyway I named all that so u could see the proper perspective. Hatton was built up by Frank Warren and was Floyds supposed boogeyman at 140. Me and Du used to be on ESPN message boards back then arguing about Hatton. I know what the world though and its easy to discredit after the fact.
  • The Lonious Monk
    The Lonious Monk Man with No Fucks Given Members Posts: 26,258 ✭✭✭✭✭
    aneed123 wrote: »
    manny was built up off of older fighters, weight and guys floyd beat first.... Eric Morrales wanted the rematch to be at a higher weight... Arum and Manny refused.... Morrales had no legs and was falling over the rings from arm punches. Raheem beat him before Manny and no one cared calling Eric washed up. anyway Arum used Floyds name to build his fighters up. Manny was not this unstoppable force. I saw him ,lose to Morrales on just a jab and right hand. I saw JMM beat him and get robbbed arguably 3 times. I saw him duck the best at 135 and cherry pick David Diaz for a belt instead of fighting Nate Campbell, Casamayor, or JMM who had followed him up in weight. anyway I named all that so u could see the proper perspective. Hatton was built up by Frank Warren and was Floyds supposed boogeyman at 140. Me and Du used to be on ESPN message boards back then arguing about Hatton. I know what the world though and its easy to discredit after the fact.

    I never understood the argument about Floyd beating them first. Who gives a 🤬 ? They weren't in a race. If ya'll are arguing that those were quality wins, then they should be quality for both not just one. It's not like Manny fought them a decade after Floyd. He fought them within a couple years of Floyd.

    And nothing you said to discredit Manny nullifies the fact that he destroyed the same people that everyone is boosting up Floyd for beating. If ya'll are going to act like Floyd is the greatest ever because he beat those guys, you can't turn around an act like Manny beating them is no big deal.
  • aneed123
    aneed123 Members Posts: 23,763 ✭✭✭✭✭
    monk if ur on the side of the argument that Floyd didnt fight anyone and u discredit his resume then u better do the same for Manny who beat them after Floyd.... Floyd can argue I exposed them or softened them up.... HATTON WAS UNDEFEATED when Floyd sent him in that turnbuckle..... Mosley was still dangerous after beating Margarito when Floyd beat him and was not there for a check like he was for Manny (Mosley wanted to fight Manny instead of Floyd and they wanted a catch weight of 145 and Roach said he was too good yet he fought him with none after he looked bad losng to Floyd)... Floyd beat Oscar at 154 with all types of stipulations while Manny fought a weight drained with iv marks in his arm Oscar (cam out of Roachs own mouth) Manny doesn't deserve the same credit if u look at it from the proper perspective
  • chi-guy
    chi-guy Members Posts: 1,980 ✭✭✭✭
    aneed123 wrote: »
    manny was built up off of older fighters, weight and guys floyd beat first.... Eric Morrales wanted the rematch to be at a higher weight... Arum and Manny refused.... Morrales had no legs and was falling over the rings from arm punches. Raheem beat him before Manny and no one cared calling Eric washed up. anyway Arum used Floyds name to build his fighters up. Manny was not this unstoppable force. I saw him ,lose to Morrales on just a jab and right hand. I saw JMM beat him and get robbbed arguably 3 times. I saw him duck the best at 135 and cherry pick David Diaz for a belt instead of fighting Nate Campbell, Casamayor, or JMM who had followed him up in weight. anyway I named all that so u could see the proper perspective. Hatton was built up by Frank Warren and was Floyds supposed boogeyman at 140. Me and Du used to be on ESPN message boards back then arguing about Hatton. I know what the world though and its easy to discredit after the fact.

    I never understood the argument about Floyd beating them first. Who gives a 🤬 ? They weren't in a race. If ya'll are arguing that those were quality wins, then they should be quality for both not just one. It's not like Manny fought them a decade after Floyd. He fought them within a couple years of Floyd.

    And nothing you said to discredit Manny nullifies the fact that he destroyed the same people that everyone is boosting up Floyd for beating. If ya'll are going to act like Floyd is the greatest ever because he beat those guys, you can't turn around an act like Manny beating them is no big deal.

    Pacquiao fought these fighters in the bigger weight classes at catch weights. He fought Cotto at 145, beat him and when it was time to talk rematch, which was the fight he originally wanted for his December date, he wanted it at another catchweight of 150lbs instead of being a champ and going the full way up. Cotto refused to fight him at a disadvantage and he took the Marquez fight instead. But he fought a slow and inactive, and coming off wrap gate fighter in Margarito at the full weight for a belt

    He fought and beat a weight drained De La Hoya, Roach himself said he saw the iv marks in Oscar's arms. True he blitzed Hatton, but Hatton wasn't the same after he got KO'd by Floyd. He didn't look good in his title defenses against Lazcano or Malinaggi and he got leveled by manny. Mayweather fought these boxers(excluding Margarito) at a time when they were considered live opponents

    By time he got to Mosley, Shane was looking for a payday. He hasn't had a KO since Cotto and that's not ironic that it happened when he fought a fighter at a catch weight. He couldn't finish Clottey who threw only a 100 punches and lumped him up. I don't think Floyd is the ATG but if he beats Canelo and then fights Martinez and beats him then you gotta put him up there, he's in my top 10-15. I blame Arum for this assumption that Manny was worthy to be considered Floyd's rival. Anybody whose followed boxing knows that Arum breeds his fighters off the back of other boxers
  • almighty breeze
    almighty breeze Members Posts: 1,928 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2012

    i dig that and i can agree. responding to your post you were saying things like "oh well he lost and he lost again after" which really minimizes the sport to me. but with this clarification i have no issue with your statments

    i was always a fan of the sport. i started following boxing on the week to week-fight by fight- "in the know basis" with the De La Hoya-Quartey fight. My favorites were a researched Sweet Pea, Hopkins & RJJ, Prince Naseem, Mosley & Trinidad. I had heard of & seen Floyd before liked what i saw but had not seen a full fight of his until 2003 against N'Dou which made me a fan

    So ill say that at the time of all fights made regardless of age or flaw. Every fighter after 2004 was promoted or truly believed to be the one to beat Floyd or be the one that was too much to handle and eventually, the one to "Shut His Mouth"; especially Judah,Corrales, Gatti, and Hatton. Floyd cashed out with De La Hoya & i dont blame him one bit but until 2007 Floyd always looked for the best fight,fighter and money. now it may be 2 out of 3 or some combo

    Manny is just a revved up version of the Cotto debacle with the media and an entire hemisphere on his side. If it happens it happens. I want the fight just like i wanted LeBrons ring: so we can actually get back to boxing/basketball

    Yeah, in looking back at my post, I really didn't make my argument too well.

    But to your comment about all these guys supposing to be the one that would shut his mouth. I don't even like Floyd and I'll still say that about half the people that were supposed to shut him up, everyone knew couldn't get the job done. I mean they tried to build the Ortiz fight up as a potential tough one for Floyd, but we all knew that he was going to walk all over him. I'm not saying Floyd doesn't have any good wins under his belt, but this is a weak time in boxing. That's not Floyd's fault though. It is his fault that he didn't take down Manny while Manny was still seen as an unstoppable force.

    you know what that is, as much as we talk about Manny having a machine, Floyd has his own and a lot is self promotion but Floyd became a fan favorite no matter how we slice it nor how many people do actually hate him. We also need to factor in that people around the sport to respect & appreciate what he does in the ring.

    Difference with manny is his technique, skill level, opponent cherry picking/being protected and the behind the scenes 🤬 that makes him looked at as mostly hype. Manny is the great white hype, only he's Phillipino.

    Even journalists that hate Floyd dont just blindly pick against him, thats foolish & ruins their credibility, instead they talk about "possibilities" or "what ___ needs to do" etc etc. It works against Floyd in that he's proven every fighter wrong that the next guy hyped esp for those that follow the Guerrero, Canelos etc we know their flaws &slim chances beforehand. So the Ortiz type fights are predicted in 2011 with all of Floyds accolades&history and its really just about that outside chance.
    Take 2011 Ortiz vs 2005-06 Floyd and every writer would be foaming at the mouth about how Ortiz might murder him in the ring.
  • Dupac
    Dupac Retired PurgatoryMembers, Writer Posts: 68,365 ✭✭✭✭✭
    aneed123 wrote: »
    Me and Du used to be on ESPN message boards back then arguing about Hatton. I know what the world thought and its easy to discredit after the fact.

    🤬 was a warzone back then.... espn.com 13th round....there was a whole army of hatton fans that were talking about how he was going to destroy floyd.....

    🤬 were adamantly saying castillo beat floyd and hatton destroyed him,,,
  • The Lonious Monk
    The Lonious Monk Man with No Fucks Given Members Posts: 26,258 ✭✭✭✭✭
    aneed123 wrote: »
    monk if ur on the side of the argument that Floyd didnt fight anyone and u discredit his resume then u better do the same for Manny who beat them after Floyd.... Floyd can argue I exposed them or softened them up.... HATTON WAS UNDEFEATED when Floyd sent him in that turnbuckle..... Mosley was still dangerous after beating Margarito when Floyd beat him and was not there for a check like he was for Manny (Mosley wanted to fight Manny instead of Floyd and they wanted a catch weight of 145 and Roach said he was too good yet he fought him with none after he looked bad losng to Floyd)... Floyd beat Oscar at 154 with all types of stipulations while Manny fought a weight drained with iv marks in his arm Oscar (cam out of Roachs own mouth) Manny doesn't deserve the same credit if u look at it from the proper perspective

    I didn't say Floyd didn't fight anyone. Ya'll 🤬 me with these strawman arguments. And yes, I don't give Manny anymore credit for beating those guys than Floyd did. And your argument that Floyd exposed them and made them easy for Manny to beat doesn't make sense. Exposing someone means you reveal their weaknesses for others to capitalize on. That would apply here if Manny fought any of those guys like Floyd did, but Manny's style is far different. Floyd may very well have exposed them, but Manny didn't follow his gameplan when he fought them.

    You guys are arguing circles. Either Floyd beat these dudes in their prime and therefore they were still big threats when Manny beat them, or Floyd beat them when they were falling off and they had fallen even farther by the time that Manny got them. But these attempts ya'll are making to try and make it seem like Floyd fought them at the height of their capability and Manny fought them when they were bums even though Manny only fought them a year later is crazy.
  • The Lonious Monk
    The Lonious Monk Man with No Fucks Given Members Posts: 26,258 ✭✭✭✭✭
    you know what that is, as much as we talk about Manny having a machine, Floyd has his own and a lot is self promotion but Floyd became a fan favorite no matter how we slice it nor how many people do actually hate him. We also need to factor in that people around the sport to respect & appreciate what he does in the ring.

    Difference with manny is his technique, skill level, opponent cherry picking/being protected and the behind the scenes 🤬 that makes him looked at as mostly hype. Manny is the great white hype, only he's Phillipino.

    Even journalists that hate Floyd dont just blindly pick against him, thats foolish & ruins their credibility, instead they talk about "possibilities" or "what ___ needs to do" etc etc. It works against Floyd in that he's proven every fighter wrong that the next guy hyped esp for those that follow the Guerrero, Canelos etc we know their flaws &slim chances beforehand. So the Ortiz type fights are predicted in 2011 with all of Floyds accolades&history and its really just about that outside chance.
    Take 2011 Ortiz vs 2005-06 Floyd and every writer would be foaming at the mouth about how Ortiz might murder him in the ring.

    The cherry picking argument doesn't work to well when most of his big fights are also Floyd's big fights. Yes, the majority of Manny's wins are against cans and people that he was guaranteed to crush. The same goes for the resumes of most big boxers. Actually, most of what you said in this post applies to all big name fighters. With Floyd it's just a little more prevalent because he's got such a love it or hate it kind of personality.
  • Dupac
    Dupac Retired PurgatoryMembers, Writer Posts: 68,365 ✭✭✭✭✭
    this post-prime thing bus me....cuz you eventually have to question.......when is floyd's prime?

    i mean people act like he's the exact same fighter he's been his entire career...

    just because he's an amazing talent and has a extremely strong skillset, doesn't mean 147 was his prime...

    i thik his prime was from 130-140...

    once he moved to 147, he was normally the smaller man, and wasn't able to ocmpletely MONSTER dudes.. btu still was fast enough and technical enough to completely outclass them...


    so you can't completely dump on his opponents when it's obvious that floyd fought them at times when the fights were still extremely profitable....people wanted to see floyd and they wanted to see the fighters he was fighting put hands on him......

    hatton and oscar are huge examples of this...

    many critics felt oscar was too big, and many thught hatton was rough enough to hurt him...


    it can easily be said for mosely and shane that all of their best days wer behind them....floyds best days were from 130-140...so one can argue floyd's been post prime himself since his 30th birthday in 2007
  • The Lonious Monk
    The Lonious Monk Man with No Fucks Given Members Posts: 26,258 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Du_Du wrote: »
    this post-prime thing bus me....cuz you eventually have to question.......when is floyd's prime?

    i mean people act like he's the exact same fighter he's been his entire career...

    just because he's an amazing talent and has a extremely strong skillset, doesn't mean 147 was his prime...

    i thik his prime was from 130-140...

    once he moved to 147, he was normally the smaller man, and wasn't able to ocmpletely MONSTER dudes.. btu still was fast enough and technical enough to completely outclass them...


    so you can't completely dump on his opponents when it's obvious that floyd fought them at times when the fights were still extremely profitable....people wanted to see floyd and they wanted to see the fighters he was fighting put hands on him......

    hatton and oscar are huge examples of this...

    many critics felt oscar was too big, and many thught hatton was rough enough to hurt him...


    it can easily be said for mosely and shane that all of their best days wer behind them....floyds best days were from 130-140...so one can argue floyd's been post prime himself since his 30th birthday in 2007

    You can make that argument, and I won't say you're wrong. Floyd has definitely proven himself to have more longevity that most of his competition. That's a different discussion though.
  • perspective@100
    [email protected] Members Posts: 1,862 ✭✭✭✭

    You can make that argument, and I won't say you're wrong. Floyd has definitely proven himself to have more longevity that most of his competition. That's a different discussion though.

    How is this a different discussion? If he is beating cats on the downward side of his own career that only lets you know how much better he is. Your whole arguement is based on him not fighting people in their prime when in fact he is years past his own prime. When he was in his prime he beat the established names. He was supposed to lose so many fights but dominated. Floyd from age 20 to 30 was the best boxer in every weight class he was in.

    When Floyd finally does take an L, I hope it wont matter in your eyes because he is well passed his prime and the fight should not count.

    But your arguement was not against Floyd to begin with right? Just making a case for the Klitschko brothers. I know you saw that vid I posted. They are not on Floyds level either.
  • The Lonious Monk
    The Lonious Monk Man with No Fucks Given Members Posts: 26,258 ✭✭✭✭✭

    You can make that argument, and I won't say you're wrong. Floyd has definitely proven himself to have more longevity that most of his competition. That's a different discussion though.

    How is this a different discussion? If he is beating cats on the downward side of his own career that only lets you know how much better he is. Your whole arguement is based on him not fighting people in their prime when in fact he is years past his own prime. When he was in his prime he beat the established names. He was supposed to lose so many fights but dominated. Floyd from age 20 to 30 was the best boxer in every weight class he was in.

    When Floyd finally does take an L, I hope it wont matter in your eyes because he is well passed his prime and the fight should not count.

    But your arguement was not against Floyd to begin with right? Just making a case for the Klitschko brothers. I know you saw that vid I posted. They are not on Floyds level either.

    It's a different discussion because saying someone managed to fight at a high level for a longer time than someone else is not the same as saying that person was a better fighter at their peak. Clearly, Manny's time in prime condition was a lot shorter than Floyd's. So there is no question that Floyd is superior there. That said, you can't say for sure that Floyd would have won 2 years ago just because Manny fell of faster.

    And in my opinion Floyd is still in his Prime. There is a difference between prime and peak. Prime just means when that person is capable of offering a high level of competition. Floyd can still do that. Peak means that the person is at the height of their capability. Floyd might not be there. If Floyd loses a fight now that everyone thinks he should win, then yes it's still a knock against him because he's shown that he can still compete at a level above everyone. Now two or three years from now when he doesn't seem to be himself at all, no I would not hold a loss against him in the same regard.

  • perspective@100
    [email protected] Members Posts: 1,862 ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2012


    It's a different discussion because saying someone managed to fight at a high level for a longer time than someone else is not the same as saying that person was a better fighter at their peak. Clearly, Manny's time in prime condition was a lot shorter than Floyd's. So there is no question that Floyd is superior there. That said, you can't say for sure that Floyd would have won 2 years ago just because Manny fell of faster.

    And in my opinion Floyd is still in his Prime. There is a difference between prime and peak. Prime just means when that person is capable of offering a high level of competition. Floyd can still do that. Peak means that the person is at the height of their capability. Floyd might not be there. If Floyd loses a fight now that everyone thinks he should win, then yes it's still a knock against him because he's shown that he can still compete at a level above everyone. Now two or three years from now when he doesn't seem to be himself at all, no I would not hold a loss against him in the same regard.

    I'm sorry but Floyd is no where near his prime. He saw his peak years ago. Floyd used to be able to use his legs to keep people out of punching distance vs him now having to shoulder roll for counters. He used to be able to hit and run where now he just uses his skills instead of pure athleticism.

    His skill set is higher than most but he is no where close to prime.

    You can't manipulate the definition of prime so your semantics make sense.

    Definition of prime=of the highest quality; excellent; a time of greatest vigour

    Being less athletic means he is not in his prime. Also, Floyd has had only 2 knockout wins since 2005. Previous to that he averaged a ko every other fight.

    Definition of Peak= the point of highest activity, achievment, or intensity...


    {Floyd fought 10 times in 97'} {7 times in 98' } {3 times in 99'} each year after that only one or two times except 2005 where he fought 3 times that year.

    By definition of those words and numbers (numbers don't lie) Floyd Peaked and left his prime in 2005.

  • The Lonious Monk
    The Lonious Monk Man with No Fucks Given Members Posts: 26,258 ✭✭✭✭✭


    It's a different discussion because saying someone managed to fight at a high level for a longer time than someone else is not the same as saying that person was a better fighter at their peak. Clearly, Manny's time in prime condition was a lot shorter than Floyd's. So there is no question that Floyd is superior there. That said, you can't say for sure that Floyd would have won 2 years ago just because Manny fell of faster.

    And in my opinion Floyd is still in his Prime. There is a difference between prime and peak. Prime just means when that person is capable of offering a high level of competition. Floyd can still do that. Peak means that the person is at the height of their capability. Floyd might not be there. If Floyd loses a fight now that everyone thinks he should win, then yes it's still a knock against him because he's shown that he can still compete at a level above everyone. Now two or three years from now when he doesn't seem to be himself at all, no I would not hold a loss against him in the same regard.

    I'm sorry but Floyd is no where near his prime. He saw his peak years ago. Floyd used to be able to use his legs to keep people out of punching distance vs him now having to shoulder roll for counters. He used to be able to hit and run where now he just uses his skills instead of pure athleticism.

    His skill set is higher than most but he is no where close to prime.

    You can't manipulate the definition of prime so your semantics make sense.

    Definition of prime=of the highest quality; excellent; a time of greatest vigour

    Being less athletic means he is not in his prime. Also, Floyd has had only 2 knockout wins since 2005. Previous to that he averaged a ko every other fight.

    Definition of Peak= the point of highest activity, achievment, or intensity...


    {Floyd fought 10 times in 97'} {7 times in 98' } {3 times in 99'} each year after that only one or two times except 2005 where he fought 3 times that year.

    By definition of those words and numbers (numbers don't lie) Floyd Peaked and left his prime in 2005.

    You might be right. He may not be in his prime, but your dictionary definition doesn't apply here. We're talking about boxing here. In boxing it's perfectly possible for someone to not be in peak condition but still be in the prime of their careers. Hell, some fighters have arguably gotten better after aging and gaining experience in place of athleticism. Prime is about ability to win not necessarily physical conditioning. That said, since Floyd has never lost, I guess you're right, he could still be out of his prime despite still being undefeatable by the current competition.

  • perspective@100
    [email protected] Members Posts: 1,862 ✭✭✭✭

    You might be right. He may not be in his prime, but your dictionary definition doesn't apply here. We're talking about boxing here. In boxing it's perfectly possible for someone to not be in peak condition but still be in the prime of their careers. Hell, some fighters have arguably gotten better after aging and gaining experience in place of athleticism. Prime is about ability to win not necessarily physical conditioning. That said, since Floyd has never lost, I guess you're right, he could still be out of his prime despite still being undefeatable by the current competition.

    I actually agree with you. I just think Floyd had more power in punching at different angles using his legs when he was younger. I do believe he has gained experience and wisdom in the ring though, and his skill set is hard to gauge considering he has been at a high level of skill even before he turned pro.



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