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New Atheist/Agnostic Thread 2013

Ajackson17
Ajackson17 On the shoulders of Giants and Elders in historyUniverseMembers Posts: 22,501 ✭✭✭✭✭
Let's discuss on how we became irreligious and your origins of beliefs or lack of.

Theists do not post any inflammantory posts or I will report you. No scriptures, no discussing how we are fools or the sort.

For me was after reading the bible and realizing it was just full of murder and blood shed and that it was copied from Sumeria, Egypt, some of it was from India, Abraham and Brahama and some other cannaanite religions. I just realized they just murder the most and indoctrinate their religion. So it's apart of mythology in my eyes.
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Comments

  • Bodhi
    Bodhi Members Posts: 7,932 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I was raised Baptist and remained that way for most of my life. You might actually find some old posts from me defending and promoting theistic belief in the G&S. I gradually removed myself from the faith after realizing that 🤬 doesn't exist through observation of those around me. Surely, I thought, if there were a 🤬 , there should be people who reflect his existence through godly lives. Obviously, I saw no one who fit that criteria. Today, I don't think that argument is as strong as it was to me then but it did open the door for me.

    I decided to leave the religion and begin my own study of spirituality so that if there were a path for me, I could take it and feel more confident about who I was spiritually. I wanted my spirituality to fit me and not to have been chosen for me.
  • Bodhi
    Bodhi Members Posts: 7,932 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Also one thing that sticks out for me during that time was dating one of my exes. We were both Christians at the time and we used to discuss the Bible sometimes. I asked her one day (I think this was shortly after I began doubting) what she thought of the fate of children who know nothing of 🤬 but die before getting that chance. She had a lot more biblical knowledge than I did back then. She told me they go to hell too because all rational people regardless of age come to know 🤬 through experience or some type of exposure so there's no such thing as not having that chance to know him. That ain't sit well with me and many Christians have said the same thing, even here on the IC. I'm not down with a 🤬 that torments children for all eternity simply for not knowing him.
  • beenwize
    beenwize Members Posts: 2,024 ✭✭
    Living in the crazy insane world that we live in you mean to tell me we have to read a book full of bloodshed and animal sacrifice for our morals? The book contains some great teachings to live by, but the main publisher and world distributer of the book has been the white man and I don't have any trust in them.
  • Ajackson17
    Ajackson17 On the shoulders of Giants and Elders in history UniverseMembers Posts: 22,501 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Thank you for your responses, and the children go to hell, that's just weird and unusual. Some of the things we believe just to make this religion real and true is mind blowing. For me to make a religion work by adding new things to it, it just means that fitting it in this world that doesn't make sense. Like for example evolution is a fact and about to become a law of nature pretty much, and if the bible has no room for it, all of genesis is false then. If we can't see this magic in this day of age and why are we force to believe in something without evidence? It's rational and logical, math is rational and logical and the universe operates in mathematical practices, so 🤬 should move in a mathematical practice, but doesn't? That just really don't sit well for me.
  • DoUwant2go2Heaven
    DoUwant2go2Heaven When the first trumpet sounds!!!! Agggghhhhhhhhh!!!!!! Babylon the GreatMembers Posts: 10,425 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Oceanic wrote: »
    I was raised Baptist and remained that way for most of my life. You might actually find some old posts from me defending and promoting theistic belief in the G&S. I gradually removed myself from the faith after realizing that 🤬 doesn't exist through observation of those around me. Surely, I thought, if there were a 🤬 , there should be people who reflect his existence through godly lives. Obviously, I saw no one who fit that criteria. Today, I don't think that argument is as strong as it was to me then but it did open the door for me.

    I decided to leave the religion and begin my own study of spirituality so that if there were a path for me, I could take it and feel more confident about who I was spiritually. I wanted my spirituality to fit me and not to have been chosen for me.

    Are you familiar with Matthew 7:21-23?

    That passage alone should have let you know that there are many people who say they are "Christians" who really aren't.

    But regardless of that fact, if 🤬 was truly your Savior (at that time) than nothing that mankind could do would have stopped you from believing in Him.

    Are you familiar with the Parable of the Sower in Matthew 13? If so, where do you believe the seed fell in your life?



  • DoUwant2go2Heaven
    DoUwant2go2Heaven When the first trumpet sounds!!!! Agggghhhhhhhhh!!!!!! Babylon the GreatMembers Posts: 10,425 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited October 2013
    Oceanic wrote: »
    Also one thing that sticks out for me during that time was dating one of my exes. We were both Christians at the time and we used to discuss the Bible sometimes. I asked her one day (I think this was shortly after I began doubting) what she thought of the fate of children who know nothing of 🤬 but die before getting that chance. She had a lot more biblical knowledge than I did back then. She told me they go to hell too because all rational people regardless of age come to know 🤬 through experience or some type of exposure so there's no such thing as not having that chance to know him. That ain't sit well with me and many Christians have said the same thing, even here on the IC. I'm not down with a 🤬 that torments children for all eternity simply for not knowing him.


    Shall not the 🤬 of all the earth do right? If you believe that ALL children who die at a young age go to hell than something is seriously wrong with your theology.
  • DoUwant2go2Heaven
    DoUwant2go2Heaven When the first trumpet sounds!!!! Agggghhhhhhhhh!!!!!! Babylon the GreatMembers Posts: 10,425 ✭✭✭✭✭
    beenwize wrote: »
    Living in the crazy insane world that we live in you mean to tell me we have to read a book full of bloodshed and animal sacrifice for our morals? The book contains some great teachings to live by, but the main publisher and world distributer of the book has been the white man and I don't have any trust in them.

    There will be no progress in human relations as long as we are still stuck on skin color. The 🤬 I serve is no respecter of persons. But in every nation he that feareth him, and worketh righteousness, is accepted with him. Amen.
  • DoUwant2go2Heaven
    DoUwant2go2Heaven When the first trumpet sounds!!!! Agggghhhhhhhhh!!!!!! Babylon the GreatMembers Posts: 10,425 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Thank you for your responses, and the children go to hell, that's just weird and unusual. Some of the things we believe just to make this religion real and true is mind blowing. For me to make a religion work by adding new things to it, it just means that fitting it in this world that doesn't make sense. Like for example evolution is a fact and about to become a law of nature pretty much, and if the bible has no room for it, all of genesis is false then. If we can't see this magic in this day of age and why are we force to believe in something without evidence? It's rational and logical, math is rational and logical and the universe operates in mathematical practices, so 🤬 should move in a mathematical practice, but doesn't? That just really don't sit well for me.


    Why don't you want to live forever with King Jesus?


  • Ajackson17
    Ajackson17 On the shoulders of Giants and Elders in history UniverseMembers Posts: 22,501 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Please let me reiterate there is no scripture or reference to scripture in this, it's discussion on why people decided to drop religion as a whole or who don't think we have evidence to put any faith towards a religious belief.
  • Ajackson17
    Ajackson17 On the shoulders of Giants and Elders in history UniverseMembers Posts: 22,501 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Thank you for your responses, and the children go to hell, that's just weird and unusual. Some of the things we believe just to make this religion real and true is mind blowing. For me to make a religion work by adding new things to it, it just means that fitting it in this world that doesn't make sense. Like for example evolution is a fact and about to become a law of nature pretty much, and if the bible has no room for it, all of genesis is false then. If we can't see this magic in this day of age and why are we force to believe in something without evidence? It's rational and logical, math is rational and logical and the universe operates in mathematical practices, so 🤬 should move in a mathematical practice, but doesn't? That just really don't sit well for me.


    Why don't you want to live forever with King Jesus?


    I respect Yeshua as a freedom fighter, but I don't place supernatural powers on him though.
  • alissowack
    alissowack Members Posts: 1,930 ✭✭✭
    Hmmm...2013 is almost over. It would be cool if someone did this annually and when next year comes around...lock the thread. Anyway, what I've noticed about the doubts and denouncement of religions is it's centered around morals; whether religions can make you a morally good person and judging from these posts, religious folk have not shown that they are any better off. It's a fair observation and it would not be wrong to point out how hypocritical "we" can be. I also noticed that because religion is supposedly about morality, then it's books should be all about it. So when a book like the Bible is found to have "blood" all on the pages, it's assumed that it's intent is to promote immorality. If the Bible is really about turning bad people into good people, then doubters have every right to denounce it and believers should seriously consider that it is they are believing in. But, I'm here to say that it is not.
  • Ajackson17
    Ajackson17 On the shoulders of Giants and Elders in history UniverseMembers Posts: 22,501 ✭✭✭✭✭
    alissowack wrote: »
    Hmmm...2013 is almost over. It would be cool if someone did this annually and when next year comes around...lock the thread. Anyway, what I've noticed about the doubts and denouncement of religions is it's centered around morals; whether religions can make you a morally good person and judging from these posts, religious folk have not shown that they are any better off. It's a fair observation and it would not be wrong to point out how hypocritical "we" can be. I also noticed that because religion is supposedly about morality, then it's books should be all about it. So when a book like the Bible is found to have "blood" all on the pages, it's assumed that it's intent is to promote immorality. If the Bible is really about turning bad people into good people, then doubters have every right to denounce it and believers should seriously consider that it is they are believing in. But, I'm here to say that it is not.

    That and the constant changes to the scriptures and writings and obivious taking other religions and than have the nerve to denounce them. The 10 commandments, psalms, proverbs all came from the ma'at. Kemet and Ta Seti have truly have been copied and demeaned. Apparently it takes 40 years to become a master in the mystery schools in Africa yet Moses has learned all of it at the age of 40. So you got to think about things like that. Everything should be taken with a grain of salt until you can learn everything in it's fullness.
  • DoUwant2go2Heaven
    DoUwant2go2Heaven When the first trumpet sounds!!!! Agggghhhhhhhhh!!!!!! Babylon the GreatMembers Posts: 10,425 ✭✭✭✭✭
    alissowack wrote: »
    Hmmm...2013 is almost over. It would be cool if someone did this annually and when next year comes around...lock the thread. Anyway, what I've noticed about the doubts and denouncement of religions is it's centered around morals; whether religions can make you a morally good person and judging from these posts, religious folk have not shown that they are any better off. It's a fair observation and it would not be wrong to point out how hypocritical "we" can be. I also noticed that because religion is supposedly about morality, then it's books should be all about it. So when a book like the Bible is found to have "blood" all on the pages, it's assumed that it's intent is to promote immorality. If the Bible is really about turning bad people into good people, then doubters have every right to denounce it and believers should seriously consider that it is they are believing in. But, I'm here to say that it is not.

    That and the constant changes to the scriptures and writings and obivious taking other religions and than have the nerve to denounce them. The 10 commandments, psalms, proverbs all came from the ma'at. Kemet and Ta Seti have truly have been copied and demeaned. Apparently it takes 40 years to become a master in the mystery schools in Africa yet Moses has learned all of it at the age of 40. So you got to think about things like that. Everything should be taken with a grain of salt until you can learn everything in it's fullness.

    No they didn't come from those sources. Stop being duped my friend.

    1. The law (10 commandments) came from 🤬 on Mt. Sinai. They were written on tablets of stone by the finger of 🤬 .

    2. Have you ever read the Psalms? How can they be attributed to the ma'at when the authors detail certain events in their lives in the Psalms? Come on get real, bruh.

    3. Proverbs are general sayings rooted in truth. Solomon wrote the majority of them.
  • DoUwant2go2Heaven
    DoUwant2go2Heaven When the first trumpet sounds!!!! Agggghhhhhhhhh!!!!!! Babylon the GreatMembers Posts: 10,425 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Thank you for your responses, and the children go to hell, that's just weird and unusual. Some of the things we believe just to make this religion real and true is mind blowing. For me to make a religion work by adding new things to it, it just means that fitting it in this world that doesn't make sense. Like for example evolution is a fact and about to become a law of nature pretty much, and if the bible has no room for it, all of genesis is false then. If we can't see this magic in this day of age and why are we force to believe in something without evidence? It's rational and logical, math is rational and logical and the universe operates in mathematical practices, so 🤬 should move in a mathematical practice, but doesn't? That just really don't sit well for me.


    Why don't you want to live forever with King Jesus?


    I respect Yeshua as a freedom fighter, but I don't place supernatural powers on him though.

    You didn't answer the question though. Do you want to live forever with King Jesus?
  • Ajackson17
    Ajackson17 On the shoulders of Giants and Elders in history UniverseMembers Posts: 22,501 ✭✭✭✭✭
    alissowack wrote: »
    Hmmm...2013 is almost over. It would be cool if someone did this annually and when next year comes around...lock the thread. Anyway, what I've noticed about the doubts and denouncement of religions is it's centered around morals; whether religions can make you a morally good person and judging from these posts, religious folk have not shown that they are any better off. It's a fair observation and it would not be wrong to point out how hypocritical "we" can be. I also noticed that because religion is supposedly about morality, then it's books should be all about it. So when a book like the Bible is found to have "blood" all on the pages, it's assumed that it's intent is to promote immorality. If the Bible is really about turning bad people into good people, then doubters have every right to denounce it and believers should seriously consider that it is they are believing in. But, I'm here to say that it is not.

    That and the constant changes to the scriptures and writings and obivious taking other religions and than have the nerve to denounce them. The 10 commandments, psalms, proverbs all came from the ma'at. Kemet and Ta Seti have truly have been copied and demeaned. Apparently it takes 40 years to become a master in the mystery schools in Africa yet Moses has learned all of it at the age of 40. So you got to think about things like that. Everything should be taken with a grain of salt until you can learn everything in it's fullness.

    No they didn't come from those sources. Stop being duped my friend.

    1. The law (10 commandments) came from 🤬 on Mt. Sinai. They were written on tablets of stone by the finger of 🤬 .

    2. Have you ever read the Psalms? How can they be attributed to the ma'at when the authors detail certain events in their lives in the Psalms? Come on get real, bruh.

    3. Proverbs are general sayings rooted in truth. Solomon wrote the majority of them.

    Read the book of the dead which was written in 2500 BC, has word for word a lot of proverbs and psalms.
  • Ajackson17
    Ajackson17 On the shoulders of Giants and Elders in history UniverseMembers Posts: 22,501 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Pretty much it's all this he said she said, I look at how old the text and when their are text much older I give them more relevance when it comes to originality.
  • LUClEN
    LUClEN Absence makes the heart grow fonder of someone else Members Posts: 20,559 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I am a sun worshiper
  • DoUwant2go2Heaven
    DoUwant2go2Heaven When the first trumpet sounds!!!! Agggghhhhhhhhh!!!!!! Babylon the GreatMembers Posts: 10,425 ✭✭✭✭✭
    alissowack wrote: »
    Hmmm...2013 is almost over. It would be cool if someone did this annually and when next year comes around...lock the thread. Anyway, what I've noticed about the doubts and denouncement of religions is it's centered around morals; whether religions can make you a morally good person and judging from these posts, religious folk have not shown that they are any better off. It's a fair observation and it would not be wrong to point out how hypocritical "we" can be. I also noticed that because religion is supposedly about morality, then it's books should be all about it. So when a book like the Bible is found to have "blood" all on the pages, it's assumed that it's intent is to promote immorality. If the Bible is really about turning bad people into good people, then doubters have every right to denounce it and believers should seriously consider that it is they are believing in. But, I'm here to say that it is not.

    That and the constant changes to the scriptures and writings and obivious taking other religions and than have the nerve to denounce them. The 10 commandments, psalms, proverbs all came from the ma'at. Kemet and Ta Seti have truly have been copied and demeaned. Apparently it takes 40 years to become a master in the mystery schools in Africa yet Moses has learned all of it at the age of 40. So you got to think about things like that. Everything should be taken with a grain of salt until you can learn everything in it's fullness.

    No they didn't come from those sources. Stop being duped my friend.

    1. The law (10 commandments) came from 🤬 on Mt. Sinai. They were written on tablets of stone by the finger of 🤬 .

    2. Have you ever read the Psalms? How can they be attributed to the ma'at when the authors detail certain events in their lives in the Psalms? Come on get real, bruh.

    3. Proverbs are general sayings rooted in truth. Solomon wrote the majority of them.

    Read the book of the dead which was written in 2500 BC, has word for word a lot of proverbs and psalms.

    Non-sense. Where are you getting this information from?
  • Ajackson17
    Ajackson17 On the shoulders of Giants and Elders in history UniverseMembers Posts: 22,501 ✭✭✭✭✭
  • Black Boy King
    Black Boy King Members Posts: 6,984 ✭✭✭✭✭
    save yourself ajackson, i know who you are, these forums have aided in your corruption
  • DoUwant2go2Heaven
    DoUwant2go2Heaven When the first trumpet sounds!!!! Agggghhhhhhhhh!!!!!! Babylon the GreatMembers Posts: 10,425 ✭✭✭✭✭

    The evidence you provided doesn't match what you put forth in this thread.
  • Ajackson17
    Ajackson17 On the shoulders of Giants and Elders in history UniverseMembers Posts: 22,501 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Okay let's get back to the topic, remember what I posted.
  • alissowack
    alissowack Members Posts: 1,930 ✭✭✭
    alissowack wrote: »
    Hmmm...2013 is almost over. It would be cool if someone did this annually and when next year comes around...lock the thread. Anyway, what I've noticed about the doubts and denouncement of religions is it's centered around morals; whether religions can make you a morally good person and judging from these posts, religious folk have not shown that they are any better off. It's a fair observation and it would not be wrong to point out how hypocritical "we" can be. I also noticed that because religion is supposedly about morality, then it's books should be all about it. So when a book like the Bible is found to have "blood" all on the pages, it's assumed that it's intent is to promote immorality. If the Bible is really about turning bad people into good people, then doubters have every right to denounce it and believers should seriously consider that it is they are believing in. But, I'm here to say that it is not.

    That and the constant changes to the scriptures and writings and obivious taking other religions and than have the nerve to denounce them. The 10 commandments, psalms, proverbs all came from the ma'at. Kemet and Ta Seti have truly have been copied and demeaned. Apparently it takes 40 years to become a master in the mystery schools in Africa yet Moses has learned all of it at the age of 40. So you got to think about things like that. Everything should be taken with a grain of salt until you can learn everything in it's fullness.

    Just as there are arguments against the authentication of the Bible, there are arguments for it. Some people have shed light on this issue and have done so convincingly that the Bible is authentic. However, when a case is made, it is met with bias; that it is thought to be an agenda behind a person ever considering that the Bible may be authentic. It's true that people can use the Bible to further a selfish cause, but I believe it's easy to...uh...notice the speck in one's eye and pay no attention to the plank in our own eye. I believe there are biases associated with these claims and is not done considering every source...enemy or friendly.
  • Ajackson17
    Ajackson17 On the shoulders of Giants and Elders in history UniverseMembers Posts: 22,501 ✭✭✭✭✭
    There is too much similiarities, I do believe there is historical references for example Hezekiah is referred by Babylonians
  • alissowack
    alissowack Members Posts: 1,930 ✭✭✭
    @emperorrises. My post was not meant to put you (or I) in a position where we have to post examples. My post is more to say that there are two sides to every argument...and if your conclusions are rooted in just going to your "trusted" sources for the facts, then you haven't fully explored the argument. If this is a non-biased conclusion, then you would hear what the "other side" has to say...and not just those who you know will tell you what you want to hear. The same would apply to me.