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The Case For Reparations.......

bambubambu *Earth & Water*Members Posts: 3,529 ✭✭✭✭✭
edited June 2014 in R & R (Religion and Race)
Two hundred fifty years of slavery. Ninety years of Jim Crow. Sixty years of separate but equal. Thirty-five years of racist housing policy. Until we reckon with our compounding moral debts, America will never be whole.

Ta-Nehisi Coates
May 21, 2014

http://www.theatlantic.com/features/archive/2014/05/the-case-for-reparations/361631/


The Case For Reparations....... 17 votes

Yea....
82%
gnsB_ARecaptimus_Prime360texas409bambufortyacreshueyCopperkzzlGlockLesnar CapitalB7figzblacktuxShawn_Michaels 14 votes
Nea.....
17%
damnkpBussy_Getta Bazz-B 3 votes
«1

Comments

  • Bussy_Getta Bussy_Getta STFUMembers Posts: 37,679 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Nea.....
    I didn't experience slavery first hand so I personally don't need to be asking for reparations.
  • jonojono Right fist = power, left fist = unity Members Posts: 30,280 ✭✭✭✭✭
    What was your ancestor's pain and suffering worth? Decades, nay...centuries of that suffering, torture etc.

    Good luck attempting to quantify that.
  • CopperCopper The WickMembers Posts: 49,531 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited June 2014
    Yea....
    300+ years of being held under a racists regimes foot has had a devastating effect on black America
    we were forced and held into poverty (40 years of equal rights vs 350 years of oppression)
    housing discrimination
    govt wiping out successful black towns
    the denial of education
    the theft of property and other possessions
    terrorism
    jim crow
    the lack of voice in laws and ordinances
    etc.
    this countries laws are not only for us they have been specifically formed to target blacks and hold us at the bottom

    maybe not reparations in a check to individuals form but some form of reparations should be seriously considered.
    put that money towards predominantly black neighborhoods, education, schools housing and opportunities

    I posted this article in the social lounge last week btw...I doubt if 6 people read it
    http://community.allhiphop.com/discussion/515956/great-atlantic-article-about-reperations#latest
  • D0wnD0wn Members Posts: 10,818 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Watch how many cacs start claiming african ancestry, if reparations are handed out.
    Pico wrote: »
    I didn't experience slavery first hand so I personally don't need to be asking for reparations.

    Uh . U have to be black 1st to discuss this.
  • MasterfultechMasterfultech Members Posts: 662 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I agree with everything Dr. King said on his way to Washington.


    Do I think it's going to happen, no. At least not right now.
  • CopperCopper The WickMembers Posts: 49,531 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Yea....
    jono wrote: »
    What was your ancestor's pain and suffering worth? Decades, nay...centuries of that suffering, torture etc.

    Good luck attempting to quantify that.
    there is no quantifying that and that's not even a question in my opinion. its about fixing the representation, equality and opportunity problems we have today as a result.
  • bambubambu *Earth & Water* Members Posts: 3,529 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited June 2014
    Yea....
    jono wrote: »
    What was your ancestor's pain and suffering worth? Decades, nay...centuries of that suffering, torture etc.

    Good luck attempting to quantify that.

    Its not really about slavery.....

    Moreso about the discriminatory housing policies that created ghettos & Chiraq...........

    The article does a good job of telling the history of how ghettos and hoods were purposely created.....

    In the 1950's & 60's.......

    Throughout 2014.......

  • jonojono Right fist = power, left fist = unity Members Posts: 30,280 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Copper wrote: »
    jono wrote: »
    What was your ancestor's pain and suffering worth? Decades, nay...centuries of that suffering, torture etc.

    Good luck attempting to quantify that.
    there is no quantifying that and that's not even a question in my opinion. its about fixing the representation, equality and opportunity problems we have today as a result.
    bambu wrote: »
    jono wrote: »
    What was your ancestor's pain and suffering worth? Decades, nay...centuries of that suffering, torture etc.

    Good luck attempting to quantify that.

    Its not really about slavery.....

    Moreso about the discriminatory housing policies that created ghettos & Chiraq...........

    The article does a good job of telling the history of how ghettos and hoods were purposely created.....

    In the 1950's & 60's.......

    Throughout 2014.......

    That's not an issue exclusive to black folks. It's a problem in general because of the kind of country we live in.
  • Bussy_Getta Bussy_Getta STFUMembers Posts: 37,679 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Nea.....
    D0wn wrote: »
    Watch how many cacs start claiming african ancestry, if reparations are handed out.
    Pico wrote: »
    I didn't experience slavery first hand so I personally don't need to be asking for reparations.

    Uh . U have to be black 1st to discuss this.

    Oh.... Guess my dad ain't black my bad.
  • bambubambu *Earth & Water* Members Posts: 3,529 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited June 2014
    Yea....
    jono wrote: »
    Copper wrote: »
    jono wrote: »
    What was your ancestor's pain and suffering worth? Decades, nay...centuries of that suffering, torture etc.

    Good luck attempting to quantify that.
    there is no quantifying that and that's not even a question in my opinion. its about fixing the representation, equality and opportunity problems we have today as a result.
    bambu wrote: »
    jono wrote: »
    What was your ancestor's pain and suffering worth? Decades, nay...centuries of that suffering, torture etc.

    Good luck attempting to quantify that.

    Its not really about slavery.....

    Moreso about the discriminatory housing policies that created ghettos & Chiraq...........

    The article does a good job of telling the history of how ghettos and hoods were purposely created.....

    In the 1950's & 60's.......

    Throughout 2014.......

    That's not an issue exclusive to black folks. It's a problem in general because of the kind of country we live in.

    Perhaps you should read some of the article.....

    This was exclusive to "blacks" in Chicago........

    And countless communities across the nation......
    Redlining, selectively granting loans and insisting that any property it insured be covered by a restrictive covenant—a clause in the deed forbidding the sale of the property to anyone other than whites. Millions of dollars flowed from tax coffers into segregated white neighborhoods.One man said his black neighbor was “probably a nice guy, but every time I look at him I see $2,000 drop off the value of my house.”

    “For perhaps the first time, the federal government embraced the discriminatory attitudes of the marketplace,” the historian Kenneth T. Jackson wrote in his 1985 book, Crabgrass Frontier, a history of suburbanization. “Previously, prejudices were personalized and individualized; FHA exhorted segregation and enshrined it as public policy. Whole areas of cities were declared ineligible for loan guarantees.” Redlining was not officially outlawed until 1968, by the Fair Housing Act. By then the damage was done—and reports of redlining by banks have continued.

    http://www.theatlantic.com/features/archive/2014/05/the-case-for-reparations/361631/

  • CopperCopper The WickMembers Posts: 49,531 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Yea....
    jono wrote: »
    Copper wrote: »
    jono wrote: »
    What was your ancestor's pain and suffering worth? Decades, nay...centuries of that suffering, torture etc.

    Good luck attempting to quantify that.
    there is no quantifying that and that's not even a question in my opinion. its about fixing the representation, equality and opportunity problems we have today as a result.
    bambu wrote: »
    jono wrote: »
    What was your ancestor's pain and suffering worth? Decades, nay...centuries of that suffering, torture etc.

    Good luck attempting to quantify that.

    Its not really about slavery.....

    Moreso about the discriminatory housing policies that created ghettos & Chiraq...........

    The article does a good job of telling the history of how ghettos and hoods were purposely created.....

    In the 1950's & 60's.......

    Throughout 2014.......

    That's not an issue exclusive to black folks. It's a problem in general because of the kind of country we live in.

    blacks are disproportionately affected by those things and more so than anyone else bc of this country
  • jonojono Right fist = power, left fist = unity Members Posts: 30,280 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Those practices are not exclusive to blacks man. Just because he found some that were doesn't mean ALL of them were that way.

    Also, banning the sell of land to "non-whites" doesn't automatically equal only blacks, Asians are effected as well. Then also you have various groups of whites that weren't considered "white" like the Irish that could also have been effected.
  • CopperCopper The WickMembers Posts: 49,531 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Yea....
    disproportionately is the keyword here
    how large was the Asian population during jim crow
    the Irish were discriminated against only in certain areas and that only lasted for a generation maybe two before they assimilated into white America
  • bambubambu *Earth & Water* Members Posts: 3,529 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Yea....
    jono wrote: »
    Those practices are not exclusive to blacks man. Just because he found some that were doesn't mean ALL of them were that way.

    Also, banning the sell of land to "non-whites" doesn't automatically equal only blacks, Asians are effected as well. Then also you have various groups of whites that weren't considered "white" like the Irish that could also have been effected.

    You really should read the article........

    Chicago is the way it is now because of racist/discriminatory housing policies..........

    Along with every other "hood" in America..........

    BTW.....

    The Irish weren't systematically targeted by predatory loan agents at major banking institutions.............

    In the 21st century.....
    “Wells Fargo mortgage had an emerging-markets unit that specifically targeted black churches because it figured church leaders had a lot of influence and could convince congregants to take out subprime loans.”

    In 2011, Bank of America agreed to pay $355 million to settle charges of discrimination against its Countrywide unit. The following year, Wells Fargo settled its discrimination suit for more than $175 million. But the damage had been done. In 2009, half the properties in Baltimore whose owners had been granted loans by Wells Fargo between 2005 and 2008 were vacant; 71 percent of these properties were in predominantly black neighborhoods.

    pastor-flying-gif.gif
  • CapitalBCapitalB all these dollars.. no sense. Members Posts: 24,556 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Yea....
    Pico wrote: »
    I didn't experience slavery first hand so I personally don't need to be asking for reparations.

    not right now Pico..
  • jonojono Right fist = power, left fist = unity Members Posts: 30,280 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Copper wrote: »
    disproportionately is the keyword here
    how large was the Asian population during jim crow
    the Irish were discriminated against only in certain areas and that only lasted for a generation maybe two before they assimilated into white America

    I don't know, that doesn't matter anyway.

    My point is whether you call it a "ghetto" or a "barrio" or "Chinatown" forced segregation happened to everyone. Of course over time it became cultural or rather a way of carving out a small piece of the country for your own (self-segregation).

    Considering we were (and I think still are) the largest minority group in the country, the effects of policies will be more likely to adversely effect how we live.
  • jonojono Right fist = power, left fist = unity Members Posts: 30,280 ✭✭✭✭✭
    bambu wrote: »
    jono wrote: »
    Those practices are not exclusive to blacks man. Just because he found some that were doesn't mean ALL of them were that way.

    Also, banning the sell of land to "non-whites" doesn't automatically equal only blacks, Asians are effected as well. Then also you have various groups of whites that weren't considered "white" like the Irish that could also have been effected.

    You really should read the article........

    Chicago is the way it is now because of racist/discriminatory housing policies..........

    Along with every other "hood" in America..........

    BTW.....

    The Irish weren't systematically targeted by predatory loan agents at major banking institutions.............

    I don't doubt that. Where you have large pockets of poverty you will inevitably have crime, that too, is not exclusive to blacks.

    As far as unfair loaning practices of the last decade...it's true but irrelevant to this conversation. The unfair loaning practices came after unfair housing practices.

    Meaning it went from you couldn't get a house or move into certain areas just because you were black to "we want to loan you money at rates we know you can't pay back" just because you are black. The institutions used the law to their advantage to 🤬 (economically) people again.

    We off the subject now though.
  • bambubambu *Earth & Water* Members Posts: 3,529 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited June 2014
    Yea....
    jono wrote: »
    bambu wrote: »
    jono wrote: »
    Those practices are not exclusive to blacks man. Just because he found some that were doesn't mean ALL of them were that way.

    Also, banning the sell of land to "non-whites" doesn't automatically equal only blacks, Asians are effected as well. Then also you have various groups of whites that weren't considered "white" like the Irish that could also have been effected.

    You really should read the article........

    Chicago is the way it is now because of racist/discriminatory housing policies..........

    Along with every other "hood" in America..........

    BTW.....

    The Irish weren't systematically targeted by predatory loan agents at major banking institutions.............

    I don't doubt that.

    We off the subject now though.

    Nah...

    We are on track.....

    How are recent modifications to a systematic form of discrimination irrelevant?????

    It shows deliberate and continuous discrimination throughout the history of the nation to the present........
  • The IconoclastThe Iconoclast harbinger of existential angst Members Posts: 1,381 ✭✭✭✭✭
    This is just my stream of consciousness since I have no clue how feasible this would be in real life:

    Before anything first you have to quantify the percentage of African one has to be be reward it and how many years of slavery said African-American must have in his/her family. Then quantify which white families owns slaves and then whether or not you add salary brackets so the amount one pays depends on their income or would the amount they pay become based on how many slaves their family owned and how long they owned them. What about the huge black population in prison, how would they factor in since most are stripped of certain rights.

    How would mixed people and families come factor in?

    The average African-American has 70-75% African DNA, so even mixed people who have 20-50% African DNA with slave ancestors could demand a share since the people are getting them are not even fully African.

    Will there be an age limit? Should the elderly get more since they were affected by slavery more than current generation?

    Man idk, I can't even picture how this whole thing would work. I'm just rambling lol...

    There's so many variables involved and this would affect the economy so much that the collateral damage could be devastating.

    The idea of getting payed for our ancestors oppression is awesome however it seems to be only cut and dry in theory, not reality. If the amount we're getting payed per person isn't substantial, is it even worth the risk? I'm leaning toward no, idk. I need to be aware of the logistics..
  • bambubambu *Earth & Water* Members Posts: 3,529 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Yea....
    This is just my stream of consciousness since I have no clue how feasible this would be in real life:

    Before anything first you have to quantify the percentage of African one has to be be reward it and how many years of slavery said African-American must have in his/her family. Then quantify which white families owns slaves and then whether or not you add salary brackets so the amount one pays depends on their income or would the amount they pay become based on how many slaves their family owned and how long they owned them. What about the huge black population in prison, how would they factor in since most are stripped of certain rights.

    How would mixed people and families come factor in?

    The average African-American has 70-75% African DNA, so even mixed people who have 20-50% African DNA with slave ancestors could demand a share since the people are getting them are not even fully African.

    Will there be an age limit? Should the elderly get more since they were affected by slavery more than current generation?

    Man idk, I can't even picture how this whole thing would work. I'm just rambling lol...

    There's so many variables involved and this would affect the economy so much that the collateral damage could be devastating.

    The idea of getting payed for our ancestors oppression is awesome however it seems to be only cut and dry in theory, not reality. If the amount we're getting payed per person isn't substantial, is it even worth the risk? I'm leaning toward no, idk. I need to be aware of the logistics..

    I don't see it as getting paid for slavery or our ancestors oppression......

    And its not about getting a check....

    Its about admitting that the ghetto was an invention of white supremacy and then taking steps to eliminate the policies that continue to maintain the ghetto housing system.....


  • zombiezombie Members Posts: 13,450 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited June 2014
    IF YOU don't have two black parents you are not black, but if you stand for the betterment of black people
    THEN you should be accepted and treated like one of us by us, but as for reparations mixed people should get nothing.

    That being said i don't believe in the concept of reparations for slavery it's just teaching black people that they can beg their way to getting what they deserve instead of taking it.
  • bambubambu *Earth & Water* Members Posts: 3,529 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Yea....
    zombie wrote: »
    IF YOU don't have two black parents you are not black, but if you stand for the betterment of black people
    THEN you should be accepted and treated like one of us by us, but as for reparations mixed people should get nothing.

    That being said i don't believe in the concept of reparations for slavery it's just teaching black people that they can beg their way to getting what they deserve instead of taking it.

    Don't start hating cause I get my cut before you do.........

  • blacktuxblacktux Members Posts: 4,559 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Yea....
    Honestly there is no way this shouldnt have happened by now.

    The mere fact that it hasnt shows that america is not genuine in all this "equality" talk and still sees minorities (Especially blacks) as pets and not people.

    They dont like your black ass. Remember that.
  • jay83jay83 Members Posts: 5,490 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Pico wrote: »
    I didn't experience slavery first hand so I personally don't need to be asking for reparations.


    tumblr_n5v3lcjURJ1s0my1wo1_250.gif
  •   Colin$mackabi$h Colin$mackabi$h Smartass Snatch Money ave.Members Posts: 16,586 ✭✭✭✭✭
    We damn sure are owed something. They should break they backs making sure we are happy.
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