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Christians, are you ready to abandon your religion?

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Comments

  • LUClEN
    LUClEN Absence makes the heart grow fonder of someone else Members Posts: 20,559 ✭✭✭✭✭
    How can a 🤬 with absolutely no belief system challenge another mans system of beliefs? Smh

    Secular beliefs ≠ no beliefs
  • zombie
    zombie Members Posts: 13,450 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Trashboat wrote: »
    zombie wrote: »
    Trashboat wrote: »
    zombie wrote: »
    Trashboat wrote: »
    zombie wrote: »
    Trashboat wrote: »
    zombie wrote: »
    does SCIENTIFIC Knowledge help you be a better father or husband or help you build character or teach you economic and general life principles??? NO

    This is full of so much fail

    EXPLAIN TO ME how science is going to help someone build character???? or give some one the discipline needs to live by economic principles??

    Economics is a soft science
    Psychology has been making improving child rearing methods for years

    "How are factual observations superior to my feelings and fiction?"

    Read what I said again the discipline needed to practice personal economic principles will not come simply by having scientific knowledge. AS for psychology read what I wrote again I said will science help me become a better father.

    being a father is not simply "child rearing". Because the job of being a father continues beyond the adulthood of your child the rearing aspect of parenthood is only a part of being a father.

    Science is a method of learning about the world

    With the scientific method we can find the best way to do anything, from raising kids to handling money

    Far more effectively than a fictional book could

    No, do you know the meaning of the word discipline??? science just brings knowledge that's it technology is the application of knowledge but that still does not actually teach discipline or build character and it sure as hell does not change character how many people have come from jail thanking the knowledge or evolution and physics for their better situation in life???? THEIR IMPROVED character

    Science is a discipline


    sonned.jpg

    I can't tell if you are a troll or a victim of the american public school system

    the word discipline has different usages/meanings depending on the context of how you use it, in the context of this discussion clearly I am not referring to "A DISCIPLINE" as in "A study". But you are not interested in hearing what I am saying you only want to troll and make corny 🤬 jokes.
  • LUClEN
    LUClEN Absence makes the heart grow fonder of someone else Members Posts: 20,559 ✭✭✭✭✭
    What you're saying does not refute anything I've said

    You ask how science can improve discipline, all one would have to do is use the scientific method to run experiments that gauge the discipline of individuals, and find the activities that lead to greater levels of it

    Not hard to understand how science, as a discipline itself, can improve life in all areas
  • zombie
    zombie Members Posts: 13,450 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 2014
    Trashboat wrote: »
    What you're saying does not refute anything I've said

    You ask how science can improve discipline, all one would have to do is use the scientific method to run experiments that gauge the discipline of individuals, and find the activities that lead to greater levels of it

    Not hard to understand how science, as a discipline itself, can improve life in all areas

    science is a discipline as in it being a study but that's not how i am using the word discipline, the word has more than one meaning and it's impossible to apply the scientific method to build discipline because discipline is far too individualized in other words there is no method that one can devise that will enforce self control on others. after all it is self control.
  • LUClEN
    LUClEN Absence makes the heart grow fonder of someone else Members Posts: 20,559 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 2014
    zombie wrote: »
    Trashboat wrote: »
    What you're saying does not refute anything I've said

    You ask how science can improve discipline, all one would have to do is use the scientific method to run experiments that gauge the discipline of individuals, and find the activities that lead to greater levels of it

    Not hard to understand how science, as a discipline itself, can improve life in all areas

    science is a discipline as in it being a study but that's not how i am using the word discipline, the word has more than one meaning and it's impossible to apply the scientific method to build discipline because discipline is far too individualized in other words there is no method that one can devise that will enforce self control on others. after all it is self control.

    Science can and already has done that

    I just explained how, one example of it is the loads of research being done on meditation and its benefits on self control

    checkmated2.jpg
  • kingblaze84
    kingblaze84 Bronx, NY birthplace of hip-hopMembers Posts: 14,288 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Seems Jesus has abandoned his followers as well.....🤬 ain't been seen in 2000 plus years
  • zombie
    zombie Members Posts: 13,450 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Trashboat wrote: »
    zombie wrote: »
    Trashboat wrote: »
    What you're saying does not refute anything I've said

    You ask how science can improve discipline, all one would have to do is use the scientific method to run experiments that gauge the discipline of individuals, and find the activities that lead to greater levels of it

    Not hard to understand how science, as a discipline itself, can improve life in all areas

    science is a discipline as in it being a study but that's not how i am using the word discipline, the word has more than one meaning and it's impossible to apply the scientific method to build discipline because discipline is far too individualized in other words there is no method that one can devise that will enforce self control on others. after all it is self control.

    Science can and already has done that

    I just explained how, one example of it is the loads of research being done on meditation and its benefits on self control

    checkmated2.jpg

    You posted none of that and related it to discipline as I used it in this thread.
  • zombie
    zombie Members Posts: 13,450 ✭✭✭✭✭
    and besides most meditation is part of some form of religious practice
  • zombie
    zombie Members Posts: 13,450 ✭✭✭✭✭
    the more time I spend on this forum the more I realize that a lot of you guys can't read you comprehend words but you really get the message in them. i'm going to have to start using simpler sentences and concepts
  • zombie
    zombie Members Posts: 13,450 ✭✭✭✭✭
    zombie wrote: »
    Thread is based on ignorance and stupidity and a total misunderstanding of the religion, nothing more than DUMB stereotypes about Christians. Following the principles of the Christian 🤬 is a way to strength power and discipline science and religion are not mutually exclusive. does SCIENTIFIC Knowledge help you be a better father or husband or help you build character or teach you economic and general life principles??? NO

    TROLL THREAD

  • zombie
    zombie Members Posts: 13,450 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Trashboat wrote: »

    The chronic regulation of pain through meditation has nothing to do with discipline as used in context.
    the second article is an analysis of what will power is and is the closest and makes the best argument for our side unfortunately while it is a good break down of ways to limit stress and what stress does to the brain it's still does not present a scientific way to get me to willing do what I don't want too which is what discipline in practice does.

    the third article sorry I am not reading all that 🤬 .

    the last one is taken from a website that is selling meditation equipment so i'm inclined to call 🤬 on everything thing there.
  • LUClEN
    LUClEN Absence makes the heart grow fonder of someone else Members Posts: 20,559 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 2014
    You defined discipline as self control and now you define it as doing what people do not want to

    If you're looking for an ideology to control people then religion is your tool

    but if you're looking for a tool to determine how to do something more quickly, or with fewer errors or how to sleep better at night or improve pain tolerance or learn how to delay gratification then science will always reign supreme

    There is nothing in religion that compares the options available to determine which is better
  • zombie
    zombie Members Posts: 13,450 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Trashboat wrote: »
    You defined discipline as self control and now you define it as doing what people do not want to

    If you're looking for an ideology to control people then religion is your tool

    ]but if you're looking for a tool to determine how to do something more quickly, or with fewer errors or how to sleep better at night or improve pain tolerance or learn how to delay gratification then science will always reign supreme

    There is nothing in religion that compares the options available to determine which is better
    it is not about competition, like in a free market, where the best option is the winner

    it's about monopoly

    It's self control that allows you to willingly do what you don't want too that is what i meant thought everyone knew that that was what discipline is . As for the bolded sure. The thing with religion is that it's whole and encompasses many of the things that much of your articles recommended and much more.

    BUT NO ONE can delay gratification better than a very religious person some have done so till the point of death
  • LUClEN
    LUClEN Absence makes the heart grow fonder of someone else Members Posts: 20,559 ✭✭✭✭✭
    religion never actually does the work of proving it
    much of what religion says has been proven to be ineffective or less desirable than alternatives

    If you do not want to do it then why are you doing it?
    Unless it is involuntary it makes no sense
    It's not self control if you're doing what others want, it's them controlling you
  • manofmorehouse
    manofmorehouse Members Posts: 2,716 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Whether you believe in a higher power or not, why judge what the next man does?? What gets me is that many atheists will sit and accuse religious believers of judging but do the exact same 🤬 . You feel like you have a handle on what life means and how you govern yours, cool. Congrats. However, knocking another 🤬 that uses religion, statues, meditation or anything else to give them a sense of clarity on their life makes you seem small minded and attention seeking. Do you. If what u believe/don't believe in works for you, why are you concerned about random 🤬 on the IC that you'll probably never meet?? I thought evangelizing or spreading the good word was a Christian thing, no??
  • LUClEN
    LUClEN Absence makes the heart grow fonder of someone else Members Posts: 20,559 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Whether you believe in a higher power or not, why judge what the next man does??

    Children Exposed To Religion Have Difficulty Distinguishing Fact From Fiction, Study Finds
  • zombie
    zombie Members Posts: 13,450 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 2014
    Trashboat wrote: »
    religion never actually does the work of proving it
    much of what religion says has been proven to be ineffective or less desirable than alternatives

    If you do not want to do it then why are you doing it? because it has to be done
    Unless it is involuntary it makes no sense
    It's not self control if you're doing what others want, it's them controlling you

    Religion never claims to want to prove everything, it's faith and never denies to be.
    what others want is not important. I of my own freewill choose to follow my religion
  • manofmorehouse
    manofmorehouse Members Posts: 2,716 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Trashboat wrote: »
    Whether you believe in a higher power or not, why judge what the next man does??

    Children Exposed To Religion Have Difficulty Distinguishing Fact From Fiction, Study Finds

    The study was conducted on 5 and 6 year olds - the same age group that believes ninja turtles and transformers are real. You serious with this 🤬 or nah??
  • LUClEN
    LUClEN Absence makes the heart grow fonder of someone else Members Posts: 20,559 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 2014
    Trashboat wrote: »
    Whether you believe in a higher power or not, why judge what the next man does??

    Children Exposed To Religion Have Difficulty Distinguishing Fact From Fiction, Study Finds

    The study was conducted on 5 and 6 year olds - the same age group that believes ninja turtles and transformers are real. You serious with this 🤬 or nah??

    corriveau-study2.jpg?w=930&h=513

    If that's true around the board then why are nonreligious kids almost twice as good as religions kids at differentiating fact from fiction?
  • LUClEN
    LUClEN Absence makes the heart grow fonder of someone else Members Posts: 20,559 ✭✭✭✭✭
    zombie wrote: »
    Trashboat wrote: »
    religion never actually does the work of proving it
    much of what religion says has been proven to be ineffective or less desirable than alternatives

    If you do not want to do it then why are you doing it? because it has to be done
    Unless it is involuntary it makes no sense
    It's not self control if you're doing what others want, it's them controlling you

    Religion never claims to want to prove everything, it's faith and never denies to be.
    what others want is not important. I of my own freewill choose to follow my religion

    If you do what you want then how are you doing what you do not want?
    It makes no sense
    you changed your definition of discipline and now you have a paradox where people are doing what they want but not doing what they want

    If someone is consciously doing something then they must want to do it
    just because Joe wants to eat McDonald's but chooses not to does not mean he is not doing what he wants, he just wants to not eat McDonald's more

    In your instance of people doing what they must: if they have to do it then they had no choice in the matter
    discipline is not even relevant if this is the definition you choose




    No matter what definition of discipline you decide to choose next science has to capacity of helping us learn how we can alter it for better and worse
  • zombie
    zombie Members Posts: 13,450 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 2014
    Trashboat wrote: »
    zombie wrote: »
    Trashboat wrote: »
    religion never actually does the work of proving it
    much of what religion says has been proven to be ineffective or less desirable than alternatives

    If you do not want to do it then why are you doing it? because it has to be done
    Unless it is involuntary it makes no sense
    It's not self control if you're doing what others want, it's them controlling you

    Religion never claims to want to prove everything, it's faith and never denies to be.
    what others want is not important. I of my own freewill choose to follow my religion

    If you do what you want then how are you doing what you do not want?
    It makes no sense
    you changed your definition of discipline and now you have a paradox where people are doing what they want but not doing what they want

    If someone is consciously doing something then they must want to do it
    just because Joe wants to eat McDonald's but chooses not to does not mean he is not doing what he wants, he just wants to not eat McDonald's more

    In your instance of people doing what they must: if they have to do it then they had no choice in the matter
    discipline is not even relevant if this is the definition you choose




    No matter what definition of discipline you decide to choose next science has to capacity of helping us learn how we can alter it for better and worse

    You are confusing what I am saying, when i spoke of doing what I want I was talking about me willingly following my religion even when it means doing what I don't want to. so if you can willingly do what you don't want to then you have discipline. I did not change the meaning of discipline I thought you already knew what I was talking about an how I was using the word. I consciously pay bills I don't want to every month.

    AS FOR the bolded SCIENCE CAN HELP people do what they willing want to do. GETTING people to do want they do not want to do is another matter.
  • MeekMonizzLLLLLLe14
    MeekMonizzLLLLLLe14 Members Posts: 15,337 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 2014
    zombie wrote: »
    Thread is based on ignorance and stupidity and a total misunderstanding of the religion, nothing more than DUMB stereotypes about Christians. Following the principles of the Christian 🤬 is a way to strength power and discipline science and religion are not mutually exclusive. does SCIENTIFIC Knowledge help you be a better father or husband or help you build character or teach you economic and general life principles??? NO
    Tell that to the family who refuses to abort 🤬 induced pregnancy, stem cell therapy, and vaccinations but religiously pay tithy and offerings to the elusive "building church fund", thinking they're getting over because that dollar in a dish is getting deducted from their taxes.

    Their is a beautiful atheist woman out their who hates getting her 🤬 ate, just for you my brother.

    You are only bringing out extremes perpetuated by right and left media for shock value. Like colin cowherd always says on his show the bible belt also statistically is one of the highest parts of the country that download porn and consume alcohol. That wouldn't be true if everyone was like the 🤬 you see on tv protesting against anything and bending the bible anyway they want for personal gain.

    The majority of christains especailly in my age range 23 are going to church but not going overboard like previous generations. They are also not buying into the b.s. of previous generations than pretty much your going to hell for doing anything fun. Personally im sick of the WWE type scripted drama church and the people who judge you in church and act holier than thou then next month they 16 year old knocked up.

    Plus bar for bar my 🤬 jesus did say some trill stuff not only to the common people but to the church. He ethered the uppity negros aka the pharasees. And the proverbs from that old testament are classic. All jokes aside i don't expect anyone to practice religion like i do but i do think it has helped my life and my system of belif's and morals.
  • Lab Baby
    Lab Baby Parts Unknown via BrooklynMembers Posts: 8,154 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Most secular knowledge is either false, corrupt, or already standing on the basis of a higher knowledge. The works science takes credit for was already known by people aeons ago with a higher connection to 🤬 . The powers that be control all this information, and we run with it without consulting our own consciousness. At the end of the day, a lot of what we "know" and "understand" is what we choose to. We know it because we BELIEVE it's true. I'm not a religious nut, but I'm not gonna knock anyone's religious beliefs and in the same breath take a science article seriously because it was monetarily funded.
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