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Identity Politics Run Amok: Autism is a culture?

2

Comments

  • atribecalledgabi
    atribecalledgabi DragonstoneMembers, Moderators Posts: 14,063 Regulator
    Deaf culture is more of a thing than autism culture
  • konceptjones
    konceptjones Old School Playa Guests, Members, Writer, Content Producer Posts: 13,139 ✭✭✭✭✭
    mryounggun wrote: »
    Turfaholic wrote: »
    There is a autism culture

    maybe for the parents of autistic children, but not for the children/adults afflicted themselves.

    Untrue. Definitely not in the way and to the extent that this dude is trying to claim. But there is definitely a culture among individuals who are afflicted.

    I would say this is true of kids with downs syndrome, but because Autism has such a huge range from barely there mentally to high functioning genius with "quirks" you can't really say that.
  • TheGOAT
    TheGOAT El Coyote unknownGuests, Members, Writer, Content Producer Posts: 15,916 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Deaf culture is more of a thing than autism culture

    I took a ASL college course and thats def true
  • deadeye
    deadeye Walmart Warrior Kat's buttMembers Posts: 22,884 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I'm starting to feel the same way about my weight.



    Strongly considering joining NAAFA and building with other people who identify as overweight.



    We've been oppressed for far too long and it's time we start fighting for our rights.
  • deadeye
    deadeye Walmart Warrior Kat's buttMembers Posts: 22,884 ✭✭✭✭✭
    deadeye wrote: »
    I'm starting to feel the same way about my weight.



    Strongly considering joining NAAFA and building with other people who identify as overweight.



    We've been oppressed for far too long and it's time we start fighting for our rights.




    n6b7u84k6hdp.gif
  • deadeye
    deadeye Walmart Warrior Kat's buttMembers Posts: 22,884 ✭✭✭✭✭
    deadeye wrote: »
    deadeye wrote: »
    I'm starting to feel the same way about my weight.



    Strongly considering joining NAAFA and building with other people who identify as overweight.



    We've been oppressed for far too long and it's time we start fighting for our rights.




    n6b7u84k6hdp.gif




    0tgx9dcjd6fm.gif
  • mohamed
    mohamed Members Posts: 1,299 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I work with autistic kids and actually they say the opposite of what the girl says. My student just recently started communicating through a new therapy called rpm (after not being proficiently verbal most of his life) and told us he fills stuck in his own body.
  • Madame_CJSkywalker
    Madame_CJSkywalker Members Posts: 940 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 2017
    jono wrote: »
    jono wrote: »
    Autism and gender dysphoria are just the beginning.

    If we start telling people their mental and medical problems are valid and no cause for concern we create some dangerous ideas.

    *We tell anorexics that its okay to be anorexic.
    *We let people with body dymorphoria chop off perfect healthy limbs because they think something is wrong with
    *We let people who have phantom pain believe their pain is real
    *We let people with PTSD think their thoughts are normal.
    *We let people with bipolar disorder act however they want because theres nothing wrong with them


    There's no such thing as mental problems, we're all just "special" and "different" despite the fact that mental illness is highly correlated with violence, criminal behavior and suicide.

    what? autism is not body dymorphoria linked to any violent or criminal behavior

    it refers to a range of conditions characterized by challenges with social skills, repetitive behaviors, speech and nonverbal communication

    they can't just take a pill or join a support group and they are all good....for many it's a life long struggle

    and this is about embracing one's self despite the challenges and stigma that we associate with ppl with autism opposed to trying to conform and deny yourself the support you may need

    considering she isn't advocating for violence or demeaning any one group or thing, she should be free to express her opinion, same as you....like with any other idea a winner will emerge from the competition of ideas in public discourse

    this argument her thinking is dangerous is actually the real danger

    None of the people I mention can just take a pill and be good. All that 🤬 is a life long struggle. Nothing you said is relevant to the post.

    I said mental illness is correlated with violence, criminal behavior, and suicide. That's a fact.

    Autism is correlated with self mutilation, same as body dysmorphics (like anorexics for instance). Also several studies have shown that a lack of social understanding leads to autistics ending up in jail (Lerner, et al., 2012).

    At the end of the day, autism is a disorder. A malfunction in the brain and in social behavior, it can and should be managed for the betterment of the patient and the society.

    It's also not healthy to let people with disorders choose their own treatment, because many think like this chick "there's nothing wrong with me." Trusting the judgment of someone who is mentally ill and untreated is naive.


    A correlation does not equal a causation. And u ever think a kid with autism could be more likely to act out if he or she bullied at school or feels isolated???? Maybe it could because they been made to feel like they were freaks

    My point with the its a life long struggle is to say the suggestion that having autism is as big a part of ones identity as there nationality or ethnicity isnt all that silly

    She actually encourages ppl to take steps to better their condition...dont recall her suggesting that should not take into consideration the recommendations of doctors and other trained professionals ...just don't jump from doctor to doctor and medication to medication chasing after a cure at the expense of the child...because there is none...

    And this idea that a person with a mental disorder, illness should be the ward of the state and have no control over their own treatments regardless of the severity of their disorder or side effects? Smh....just wow


    Also mental illness is a poor predictor of violence, ranking well after these factors: youth, male gender, history of violence, or poverty. Aside from people who abuse substances, people with mental illness commit violent acts at the same rate as nonpatients, and 80 percent to 90 percent of people with mental illness never commit violent acts.

    http://psychnews.psychiatryonline.org/doi/full/10.1176/pn.36.9.0010

    Like she said she focus should not be on achieving normalcy, but instead on learning to live happily and productively AS AUTISTICS

    Fake news
  • 808HiLife808
    808HiLife808 Members Posts: 1,072 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November 2017
    jono wrote: »
    "Nor do we refer to said people as "having Chinese tendencies,"




    we do over here...pake
  • blakfyahking
    blakfyahking The IC's Resident Father Figure Members Posts: 15,785 ✭✭✭✭✭
    yeah I don't see a problem with this

    if this makes them feel better about it, then what's the problem?

    I'm surprised that more people are not cool with this considering how liberal mofos tend to be on this forum
  • Will Munny
    Will Munny Eatin pussy and kickin ass Members Posts: 30,199 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Idc if u wanna be austisric I’m not gonna hold u back from it.
  • Mister B.
    Mister B. Still the Devil's #1 Advocate. Come on out that box! Members, Writer Posts: 16,171 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November 2017
    As a teacher primarily of autistic children, I do understand why someone would do this. There is a documentary of a set of men going around the world, trying to build a global network of autistic people like himself to help raise awareness for people living with autism, and I'm with that. Some of you really have no idea how different and difficult living as a person with autism - or even working, teaching, or caring for one - can be.

    HOWEVER....

    I think what's going to help people diagnosed on the Spectrum is to not make their Autism their whole identity. This doesn't help that cause. And in school, it's almost illegal to try to separate Autistic children from general Education kids.
  • jono
    jono Right fist = power, left fist = unity Members Posts: 30,280 ✭✭✭✭✭
    jono wrote: »
    jono wrote: »
    Autism and gender dysphoria are just the beginning.

    If we start telling people their mental and medical problems are valid and no cause for concern we create some dangerous ideas.

    *We tell anorexics that its okay to be anorexic.
    *We let people with body dymorphoria chop off perfect healthy limbs because they think something is wrong with
    *We let people who have phantom pain believe their pain is real
    *We let people with PTSD think their thoughts are normal.
    *We let people with bipolar disorder act however they want because theres nothing wrong with them


    There's no such thing as mental problems, we're all just "special" and "different" despite the fact that mental illness is highly correlated with violence, criminal behavior and suicide.

    what? autism is not body dymorphoria linked to any violent or criminal behavior

    it refers to a range of conditions characterized by challenges with social skills, repetitive behaviors, speech and nonverbal communication

    they can't just take a pill or join a support group and they are all good....for many it's a life long struggle

    and this is about embracing one's self despite the challenges and stigma that we associate with ppl with autism opposed to trying to conform and deny yourself the support you may need

    considering she isn't advocating for violence or demeaning any one group or thing, she should be free to express her opinion, same as you....like with any other idea a winner will emerge from the competition of ideas in public discourse

    this argument her thinking is dangerous is actually the real danger

    None of the people I mention can just take a pill and be good. All that 🤬 is a life long struggle. Nothing you said is relevant to the post.

    I said mental illness is correlated with violence, criminal behavior, and suicide. That's a fact.

    Autism is correlated with self mutilation, same as body dysmorphics (like anorexics for instance). Also several studies have shown that a lack of social understanding leads to autistics ending up in jail (Lerner, et al., 2012).

    At the end of the day, autism is a disorder. A malfunction in the brain and in social behavior, it can and should be managed for the betterment of the patient and the society.

    It's also not healthy to let people with disorders choose their own treatment, because many think like this chick "there's nothing wrong with me." Trusting the judgment of someone who is mentally ill and untreated is naive.


    A correlation does not equal a causation. And u ever think a kid with autism could be more likely to act out if he or she bullied at school or feels isolated???? Maybe it could because they been made to feel like they were freaks
    Because autism isn't normal. Also, I never said anything about causation. Every kid gets bullied, you can get bullied because you have bucked teeth or because you have cheap shoes. Neither of which is the same as having a debilitating social disorder.

    My point with the its a life long struggle is to say the suggestion that having autism is as big a part of ones identity as there nationality or ethnicity isnt all that silly
    Its ludicrous. You talking about an individual building their identity around a sickness, its almost as if you're the one making fun of them.
    She actually encourages ppl to take steps to better their condition...dont recall her suggesting that should not take into consideration the recommendations of doctors and other trained professionals ...just don't jump from doctor to doctor and medication to medication chasing after a cure at the expense of the child...because there is none...
    None of this was stated by anyone.
    And this idea that a person with a mental disorder, illness should be the ward of the state and have no control over their own treatments regardless of the severity of their disorder or side effects? Smh....just wow
    Again, none of this was stated. The govt wasn't even mentioned. The fact is, mentally ill people are not always aware of their illness or the severity of it. Thats just a fact.

    Thinking a mentally ill person is a 🤬 doctor is ridiculous. They can only answer whether treatment is working or not. A professional needs to decide whether treatment is necessary, and what that treatment should be
    Also mental illness is a poor predictor of violence, ranking well after these factors: youth, male gender, history of violence, or poverty. Aside from people who abuse substances, people with mental illness commit violent acts at the same rate as nonpatients, and 80 percent to 90 percent of people with mental illness never commit violent acts.
    Never made the comment that mental illness is a predictor to crime. I said correlation. Looking at simple jail stats you can see that over 50% of inmates have some kind of mental illness or learning disability. And guess what? It's usually untreated. Y'know, people living their whole lives acting out and not knowing why and nobody gave a 🤬 enough to find out.
    Like she said she focus should not be on achieving normalcy, but instead on learning to live happily and productively AS AUTISTICS

    Fake news

    Normalcy is impossible. Rejecting treatment and possible cures because its a threat to your political grandstanding is nonsense.

    Most of this response is straw man fallacies and misrepresenting what i said. Keep this up and I'm not going to keep reading all this 🤬 .
  • jono
    jono Right fist = power, left fist = unity Members Posts: 30,280 ✭✭✭✭✭
    She literally said:
    To cure us would be to stamp out our whole way of life, and this is NOT good medical practice or the like-it is genocide born of xenophobia-a fear of outsiders. In many ways we spectrumites are the ultimate outsiders, but that DOES NOT make our way of being less worthwhile. This is why I and most other adults on the spectrum are anti-cure.

    She literally said curing autism is genocide.
    Curing a 🤬 sickness is genocide.
    A sickness is being equated to a race of people.

    Am I the only 🤬 reading these words? Maybe we ought to consult some of the autistic folks that ram their heads against the walls or scream in fear if a stranger comes near them.

    You can tell who has no experience with autistic people. That 🤬 is no way to live. Unless you far on the spectrum most can't even function by themselves. What kind of life is that?
  • Alpha_Ambition
    Alpha_Ambition Members Posts: 9,698 ✭✭✭✭✭
    TheGOAT wrote: »
    I dont believe in "autism"

    Fake news

    Explain
  • LordZuko
    LordZuko Black Ronin A swirling tempest in the midnight sunMembers Posts: 2,473 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Whites realize the value in being considered a minority.

    White women were the first to do this.

    Now essentially if you gather two or three retards together they can declare themselves a culture and lobby for protection status.

    It's not even a special or unique designation because everyone is autistic to some degree

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-3502928/EVERY-one-autistic-spectrum-experience-key-symptoms-just-varying-degrees.html
  • mohamed
    mohamed Members Posts: 1,299 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Will Munny wrote: »
    Idc if u wanna be austisric I’m not gonna hold u back from it.

    I definitely read that as the word ‘altruistic’ you got me.
  • mohamed
    mohamed Members Posts: 1,299 ✭✭✭✭✭
    jono wrote: »
    She literally said:
    To cure us would be to stamp out our whole way of life, and this is NOT good medical practice or the like-it is genocide born of xenophobia-a fear of outsiders. In many ways we spectrumites are the ultimate outsiders, but that DOES NOT make our way of being less worthwhile. This is why I and most other adults on the spectrum are anti-cure.

    She literally said curing autism is genocide.
    Curing a 🤬 sickness is genocide.
    A sickness is being equated to a race of people.

    Am I the only 🤬 reading these words? Maybe we ought to consult some of the autistic folks that ram their heads against the walls or scream in fear if a stranger comes near them.

    You can tell who has no experience with autistic people. That 🤬 is no way to live. Unless you far on the spectrum most can't even function by themselves. What kind of life is that?

    That’s what’s confusing me about her stance. As a person who works with autistic students, the ones who have recent breakthroughs with communication have expressed that they do feel imprisjned by their bodies which is the total opposite of what she’s saying.

    Consign this. It’s sounds like she’s has an agenda
    LordZuko wrote: »
    Whites realize the value in being considered a minority.

    White women were the first to do this.

    Now essentially if you gather two or three retards together they can declare themselves a culture and lobby for protection status.

    It's not even a special or unique designation because everyone is autistic to some degree

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-3502928/EVERY-one-autistic-spectrum-experience-key-symptoms-just-varying-degrees.html

  • Madame_CJSkywalker
    Madame_CJSkywalker Members Posts: 940 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 2017
    jono wrote: »
    She literally said:
    To cure us would be to stamp out our whole way of life, and this is NOT good medical practice or the like-it is genocide born of xenophobia-a fear of outsiders. In many ways we spectrumites are the ultimate outsiders, but that DOES NOT make our way of being less worthwhile. This is why I and most other adults on the spectrum are anti-cure.

    She literally said curing autism is genocide.
    Curing a 🤬 sickness is genocide.
    A sickness is being equated to a race of people.

    Am I the only 🤬 reading these words? Maybe we ought to consult some of the autistic folks that ram their heads against the walls or scream in fear if a stranger comes near them.

    You can tell who has no experience with autistic people. That 🤬 is no way to live. Unless you far on the spectrum most can't even function by themselves. What kind of life is that?

    this disorder, like her race or nationality, will color the way she sees the world and the world treats regardless of how much she or anyone try to fight it...

    it being a part of her identity is not so much a choice, but the acceptance of this fact

    genocide was not the right word, think her concern is that now we are seeing this fear and stigmatization of autism causing parents to over medicate, treat their autistic children and or avoid giving children vaccinations they need

    and like i said mental illness is a poor predictor of violence or criminality or even suicide opposed to things like income and gender. and she never says ppl should reject treatment or the recommendations of medical professionals so i'm just trying to figure out where is this outrage from you coming from

    you also argued it is not healthy to let people with disorders choose their own treatment, but not everyone with a disorder has a guardian or someone there to make these decisions. so what is the alternative? not to mention the severity of autism varies. there are many adults who are living with autism and doing well for themselves who have had the freedom to choose what treatment available works best

    most importantly if a treatment is not working and or causing a person to get ill or feel less present ...depending on the individual's history, they should have a say in what treatment they participate in or what medication is being pumped into their body

    just not seeing the big deal
  • Lefty_
    Lefty_ The Ayatollah Of Baking Soda Pullin Up.....Members, Writer Posts: 3,506 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Let them live their lives as they see fit.
  • LUClEN
    LUClEN Absence makes the heart grow fonder of someone else Members Posts: 20,559 ✭✭✭✭✭
    This isn't new thinking. I remember I made a thread about how people who are deaf or have dwarfism are choosing for their children to inherit those traits because they want to keep them within those "cultures" (lifestyle seems like a more reasonable term but that's a different conversation).

    If anyone is interested I'm starting a special interest group for ugly people.
  • semi-auto-mato
    semi-auto-mato Members Posts: 2,833 ✭✭✭✭✭
    this is not an argument. the person writing it doesn't have a good grasp of what culture means. a large part of culture is how we transfer information and learn. the author would have to identity some basic things language. i do not know of a autistic language. is there an autistic religion? any type of art or dance that we can attribute to autism? these are basic things that identify culture and until the author can identify those there is no discussion about autism being a culture.

    there are different degrees of autism. Some people can function perfectly fine and others cannot even talk. if the author wants to argue a case then it should be about what types of autism should be considered a disability and what types should not. my son has asperger syndrome. he is a freshman in college and he functions perfectly fine. he can be awkward though. it is not a disability but it definitely is not his culture.
  • deadeye
    deadeye Walmart Warrior Kat's buttMembers Posts: 22,884 ✭✭✭✭✭
    jono wrote: »
    jono wrote: »
    jono wrote: »
    Autism and gender dysphoria are just the beginning.

    If we start telling people their mental and medical problems are valid and no cause for concern we create some dangerous ideas.

    *We tell anorexics that its okay to be anorexic.
    *We let people with body dymorphoria chop off perfect healthy limbs because they think something is wrong with
    *We let people who have phantom pain believe their pain is real
    *We let people with PTSD think their thoughts are normal.
    *We let people with bipolar disorder act however they want because theres nothing wrong with them


    There's no such thing as mental problems, we're all just "special" and "different" despite the fact that mental illness is highly correlated with violence, criminal behavior and suicide.

    what? autism is not body dymorphoria linked to any violent or criminal behavior

    it refers to a range of conditions characterized by challenges with social skills, repetitive behaviors, speech and nonverbal communication

    they can't just take a pill or join a support group and they are all good....for many it's a life long struggle

    and this is about embracing one's self despite the challenges and stigma that we associate with ppl with autism opposed to trying to conform and deny yourself the support you may need

    considering she isn't advocating for violence or demeaning any one group or thing, she should be free to express her opinion, same as you....like with any other idea a winner will emerge from the competition of ideas in public discourse

    this argument her thinking is dangerous is actually the real danger

    None of the people I mention can just take a pill and be good. All that 🤬 is a life long struggle. Nothing you said is relevant to the post.

    I said mental illness is correlated with violence, criminal behavior, and suicide. That's a fact.

    Autism is correlated with self mutilation, same as body dysmorphics (like anorexics for instance). Also several studies have shown that a lack of social understanding leads to autistics ending up in jail (Lerner, et al., 2012).

    At the end of the day, autism is a disorder. A malfunction in the brain and in social behavior, it can and should be managed for the betterment of the patient and the society.

    It's also not healthy to let people with disorders choose their own treatment, because many think like this chick "there's nothing wrong with me." Trusting the judgment of someone who is mentally ill and untreated is naive.


    A correlation does not equal a causation. And u ever think a kid with autism could be more likely to act out if he or she bullied at school or feels isolated???? Maybe it could because they been made to feel like they were freaks
    Because autism isn't normal. Also, I never said anything about causation. Every kid gets bullied, you can get bullied because you have bucked teeth or because you have cheap shoes. Neither of which is the same as having a debilitating social disorder.

    My point with the its a life long struggle is to say the suggestion that having autism is as big a part of ones identity as there nationality or ethnicity isnt all that silly
    Its ludicrous. You talking about an individual building their identity around a sickness, its almost as if you're the one making fun of them.
    She actually encourages ppl to take steps to better their condition...dont recall her suggesting that should not take into consideration the recommendations of doctors and other trained professionals ...just don't jump from doctor to doctor and medication to medication chasing after a cure at the expense of the child...because there is none...
    None of this was stated by anyone.
    And this idea that a person with a mental disorder, illness should be the ward of the state and have no control over their own treatments regardless of the severity of their disorder or side effects? Smh....just wow
    Again, none of this was stated. The govt wasn't even mentioned. The fact is, mentally ill people are not always aware of their illness or the severity of it. Thats just a fact.

    Thinking a mentally ill person is a 🤬 doctor is ridiculous. They can only answer whether treatment is working or not. A professional needs to decide whether treatment is necessary, and what that treatment should be
    Also mental illness is a poor predictor of violence, ranking well after these factors: youth, male gender, history of violence, or poverty. Aside from people who abuse substances, people with mental illness commit violent acts at the same rate as nonpatients, and 80 percent to 90 percent of people with mental illness never commit violent acts.
    Never made the comment that mental illness is a predictor to crime. I said correlation. Looking at simple jail stats you can see that over 50% of inmates have some kind of mental illness or learning disability. And guess what? It's usually untreated. Y'know, people living their whole lives acting out and not knowing why and nobody gave a 🤬 enough to find out.
    Like she said she focus should not be on achieving normalcy, but instead on learning to live happily and productively AS AUTISTICS

    Fake news

    Normalcy is impossible. Rejecting treatment and possible cures because its a threat to your political grandstanding is nonsense.

    Most of this response is straw man fallacies and misrepresenting what i said.







    Keep this up and I'm not going to keep reading all this 🤬 .



    dczbjx9abdxm.gif




    l21eyktvuuif.gif





    @jono




    Welcome to my world bruh.
  • skpjr78
    skpjr78 Members Posts: 7,311 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November 2017
    Change the word autism to cancer and see how ridicoulous that 🤬 sounds. Foh

    CANCER is not a disease, a disorder, or something holding me prisoner in a shell. CANCER is a culture, a lifestyle, and a way of being. We don't try to cure people of being Chinese, because that is unethical and impossible. Nor do we refer to said people as "having Chinese tendencies," because that sounds stupid and we recognize that someone's nationality is part of WHO THEY ARE.

    CANCER doesn't yet get the respect as a culture that it deserves. People don't realize that CANCER shades into personality and is crucial to us remaining who we truly are. Because CANCER was woefully under-identified in the past, we are a relatively new disability culture. 

    The focus should not be on achieving normalcy, but instead on learning to live happily and productively AS CANCER PATIENTS


  • Will Munny
    Will Munny Eatin pussy and kickin ass Members Posts: 30,199 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Well many people function perfectly fine with autism. There’s adults all over that fell through the cracks like me that are autistic as 🤬 but never got a diagnosis.