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Who's the better overall artist. Pac or Jay-Z?

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Comments

  • weezyfgarbageweezyfgarbage Members Posts: 1,673
    edited April 2010
    isayas wrote: »
    Jay-Z's content is totally underrated. They always think he's talkin' about money, cars, hoes. Just because he doesn't do that revolutionary 🤬 doesn't mean his content is limited.

    exactly...if you listen to "money, cash, hoes" he satirizes that misconception of him.
  • isayasisayas Confirm Email Posts: 2,972 ✭✭
    edited April 2010
    exactly...if you listen to "money, cash, hoes" he satirizes that misconception of him.

    Oh, word? I gotta listen to it, again.
  • nyniccanynicca Banned Users Posts: 877
    edited April 2010
    i gotta go with the ballerina
  • georgia boigeorgia boi Members Posts: 3,359 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited April 2010
    ^lol so? Nas does that too, and with sharper lyricism. Too bad nas's voice isn't as dynamic as pac's.


    Rap is rhythm and poetry. Poetry by itself isn't rap. It's not backwards compatible, which is what the other guy (or was it you?) was trying to say. LOL @ accusing me of being a jay stan, and what does kanye have to do with this discussion at all? (even though that statement is correct).



    That's not what I'm arguing at all...learn to read. I'm talking about style...if your style is based on experiences you have never experienced, you're fake as 🤬 (yes this is post-94 pac im talking about). Please don't compare movie makers to musicians, that's whole different discussion on what it means to be an "artist."

    I never said that poetry and rap were backwards compatible. I said that Pac was a poet and it showed in his music. Pac made music that was poetic meaning the lyrics were poetic. As for the movie maker to musician comparison, how is a musician artistic, but not a movie maker? One is painting a picture verbally, while the other is painting a picture visually.

    "Gangsta" wasn't Pac's style, that was more so his image which could be argued as fake, but that isn't the argument. The argument is about Pac's artistry, not his image. For example, Jay's American Gangster is loosely based on a film or the fact that the Reasonable Doubt Jay has Jay being more king pin than he is just an everyday hustler on some songs.
  • emceemurdaemceemurda Members Posts: 258 ✭✭
    edited April 2010
    jay-z better rapper.. 2pac is a poet..

    "wake up and ask myself, is life worth living should i blast myself?"

    "pull a trigger 🤬 a 🤬 , hes a hero"

    "instead of a war on poverty, they got a war on drugs so the police can bother me"

    "i ain't saying im a change the world, but i guarantee i will spark the brain that will change the world"

    "It's hard to be an angel when your living in hell"

    "they got money for wars but can't feed the poor" - In one line he just said something that people try to explain in there entire discography's
  • thesynthesisthesynthesis Members Posts: 9,230 ✭✭✭
    edited April 2010
    ^lol so? Nas does that too, and with sharper lyricism. Too bad nas's voice isn't as dynamic as pac's.

    "

    thats not the point......the point is pac can spit a political track and then spit a track for hoes or the thugs, or the women, moms, whoever

    nas tried to spit for the hoes on oochie wally and 🤬 laughed at him and called him lame, he even called himself lame for that 🤬 lmao..

    nas is dope, but he's not an all round artist who can cover every topic like pac..

    same with jigga they stick to one lane and don't step out of it...and when they try to step out of it they just dont sound right

    pac did it all.. he was the master of all styles....thats why 🤬 like me can listen to a pac album and be like satisfied without having to stop after one song and play another artist...

    and all this 🤬 about sharper lyricism....🤬 when i listen to music i dont wanna sit there trying to unravel the da vinci code for every damn song....pac kept it simple to reach everyday 🤬 and 🤬 who aint even listen to hip hop....
  • thesynthesisthesynthesis Members Posts: 9,230 ✭✭✭
    edited April 2010
    usmarin3 wrote: »
    lets not forget that Pac wasn't a great business man, he died broke.

    u do realize pac was still yet to see his recoup...when u sell 9 million albums you dont get 11 mill in ur bank account the next day, it takes over 2 years to see that money....pac wasnt even on deathrow for a year.

    🤬 learn about the industry


    when biggy died he aint have 🤬 in his account....after he died diddy gave 3 mill to his moms..go look it up...

    labels will give u an advance, which isnt much untill u get to see ur money...pac wud have got his millions...a rapper gets paid bottom of the food chain after the record execs, producers, engineers and ceo..

    pac died broke he wasnt alive to see his recoup.

    while on death-row he spent over 2 million
  • qawshunqawshun Members Posts: 9,138 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited April 2010
    Seven straight summers, critics might not admit it
    But nobody in rap did it, quite like I did it
    If you did it I done it before, you get I had it
    Got mad at it and don't want it no more
    And that goes for everything from flippin that raw
    Flippin 🤬 , flippin vocal chords, don't get it twisted
    Get it right, did different, did it better, did it nice
    Did the impossible then did it twice (get it right)

    Jay wins anyone saying other wise is only saying that cause pac dead
  • gee757gee757 Members Posts: 26,374
    edited April 2010
    n.mcfly wrote: »
    Seven straight summers, critics might not admit it
    But nobody in rap did it, quite like I did it
    If you did it I done it before, you get I had it
    Got mad at it and don't want it no more
    And that goes for everything from flippin that raw
    Flippin 🤬 , flippin vocal chords, don't get it twisted
    Get it right, did different, did it better, did it nice
    Did the impossible then did it twice (get it right)

    Jay wins anyone saying other wise is only saying that cause pac dead

    when will yall j groupiez get da fact if 2pac was alive jigga would not b n da position hez n now n ya head???????? j is da 1 that said "LADIEZ LUV ME LONG TIME LIKE TUPACZ SOUL" & "ROCAFELLA B DA NU DEATHROW"....da poll showz TUPAC WON!!!!!!!!!
  • ItzGravitationItzGravitation Members Posts: 7,205
    edited April 2010
    Pac might have knew the solution but was so untrue to himself and his artform he died and alot of 🤬 want to be thugs now
    alot of Pac fans wont live the 🤬 he spit about except the ignorance he spit with all that thug life 🤬
    he was counterproductive to his greatest message because he would rather plz gangs and Suge
    he was a waste of talent if you ask me because he could have changed the world for the better but chose to be a fake 🤬
  • churchboy2churchboy2 Members Posts: 477
    edited April 2010
    u dumb 🤬 pac was only 25, he was the biggest selling rapper and most famous before he died...

    nobody gave a 🤬 about who is the GOAT when Pac and Big were alive...that 🤬 aint matter

    when pac was gone and then u had these new 🤬 like jay come up and self proclaim themselves as the greatest, then 🤬 was like hol up...pac is the greatest or big is the greatest


    jay is self proclaimed greatest....but most 🤬 dont agree with that title....same way LL claims he the greatest, 🤬 laugh

    pac was so ahead of his time he predicted his greatness while alive on the last song he recorded....

    "Probably be murdered for this 🤬 that I said
    I bring the real.
    Be a legend breathing or dead"

    🤬 ur were obviously 5 years old when pac was alive,,,, what deep prophetic 🤬 has jay z made?

    1) I was in my 20s when Pac was alive... how old are you young'un? I know what I'm talking about. Like I said, I don't buy this revisionist view of Pac.

    His rep now is far beyond what it was when he was alive.

    He was popular, yes. But the G.O.A.T., all-supreme, wise voice of the prophet of all things Black, NO!
    2) I never said that jay was prophetic... I never even said that he was the greatest.

    I simply siad that he was the better artist of the two.

    This thread is not about G.O.A.T.

    Read before you post homie.

    3) What does "Pac being only 25" have to do with anything? Again, read before you respond.

    4) When Pac was alive he was NOT actually famous for his rapping.

    It was that he made himself a lightning rod for Black issues in the media.

    His music and his acting were vehicles for that, yes.

    But when he was alive, he WAS NOT the "rapper's rapper" by any stretch of the imagination.

    You couldn't hear a news report that mentioned hip-hop/black youth culture w/o hearing Pac's name. His persona and influence were that big.

    But in terms of MC'ing, BIG & Nas were still the standard bearers.

    5) I am not interested in continuing this discussion with you. You are clearly more interested in posting shock barbs than discussing intelligently. Have a nice day.
  • thesynthesisthesynthesis Members Posts: 9,230 ✭✭✭
    edited April 2010
    nobody here is saying pac was a revolutionist or a prophet

    ur man nas calls himself a prophet which makes me laugh..but u'd probably agree nas is some kind of prophet right lol?

    pac was not perfect, dude was contradictory as hell, but thats what makes him so real....we as humans are contradictory, i feel sorry for them kids starving in africa, but i'm still over here throwing away food if i feel like it

    i respect women, but i cant help see them on some sexual 🤬 ....

    i rather 🤬 dont fight, but if a 🤬 step i'mma push his 🤬 back without hesitation.

    u see we are all walking contradictions.

    i like how pac was saying he'd one day like to change the world or inspire someone to do it...which his music might manage..for even for him to say that, i respect that....

    forget all this rappers rapper 🤬 , it's people who buy ur music, it's about the listeners, and pac reached the masses.

    his music to me is soul music, i dont care if dude ain't spit a 1000 punchlines or get technical with it.....there is always a song that pac made that we all can relate to

    mary j blige aint the best singer...she's not as technically sound or pitch perfect like whitney or mariah on the mic, she dont got it technically them two, but she damn sure is still the queen of r&b hip hop...and holds her own against them

    there is no rules when it comes to mc'ig....get of ur high horse dog



    he is a better artist than nas, big, jay whoever....
  • ItzGravitationItzGravitation Members Posts: 7,205
    edited April 2010
    speak for yourself on that contradiction 🤬
  • thesynthesisthesynthesis Members Posts: 9,230 ✭✭✭
    edited April 2010
    gee757 wrote: »
    when will yall j groupiez get da fact if 2pac was alive jigga would not b n da position hez n now n ya head???????? j is da 1 that said "LADIEZ LUV ME LONG TIME LIKE TUPACZ SOUL" & "ROCAFELLA B DA NU DEATHROW"....da poll showz TUPAC WON!!!!!!!!!

    word these 🤬 make me laugh, let me quote HOV

    Jay z "oh! This must be the way the 🤬 'Pac felt when he made
    "Me Against the World," "All Eyez on Me"
    Y'all 🤬 got me feelin like all eyes on me, me against the world
    Mmm, y'all got me on my 🤬 "
    ---

    there favorite rapper talking about feeling like Pac
  • thesynthesisthesynthesis Members Posts: 9,230 ✭✭✭
    edited April 2010
    speak for yourself on that contradiction 🤬

    obviously uve never contradicted urself rite>?

    mlk, malcom, ghandi contradicted themselves, but ItzGravitation is the perfect human being....

    how do u do it, whats ur secret? maybe sitting in a room alone on the internet all day everyday having no contact with the outside world?
  • ItzGravitationItzGravitation Members Posts: 7,205
    edited April 2010
    obviously uve never contradicted urself rite>?

    mlk, malcom, ghandi contradicted themselves, but ItzGravitation is the perfect human being....

    how do u do it, whats ur secret? maybe sitting in a room alone on the internet all day everyday having no contact with the outside world?

    on the internet all day...no
    being perfect is natural for me
  • weezyfgarbageweezyfgarbage Members Posts: 1,673
    edited April 2010
    word these 🤬 make me laugh, let me quote HOV

    Jay z "oh! This must be the way the 🤬 'Pac felt when he made
    "Me Against the World," "All Eyez on Me"
    Y'all 🤬 got me feelin like all eyes on me, me against the world
    Mmm, y'all got me on my 🤬 "
    ---

    there favorite rapper talking about feeling like Pac

    Lol that's because comparing yourself favorably to pac or big after 1996 became the cool thing to do. The 1996 jay-z was a superior rapper and artist, get over it.
  • thesynthesisthesynthesis Members Posts: 9,230 ✭✭✭
    edited April 2010
    Lol that's because comparing yourself favorably to pac or big after 1996 became the cool thing to do. The 1996 jay-z was a superior rapper and artist, get over it.

    lol jay stans stay making excuses

    jay over there remaking pac songs and shouting him out...🤬 even shouted him out in his verse for the glastonbury gig

    🤬 pac werent remaking jay song, pac was 🤬 that big lipped 🤬 ..

    🤬 even pacs "🤬 jay z" was sampled for ether

    pac been 🤬 on hov even when he was dead, while hov trying to suck up to that 🤬 and even recorded a verse for better days album...

    they interviewed beyonce in some magazine recently ans asked her "if you could go on a dinner date with anyone dead or alive, who would it be " , she said "2pac" lmaooo....beyonce getting wet thinking of pac even though she married to hov

    hov cant never shake pac off
  • great lgreat l Members Posts: 393
    edited April 2010
    Jay of course. Lots of people get caught up with the hype and imagery that's Tupac. If your ass wasn't at least 15 when he died, you shouldn't even be posting.
  • ItzGravitationItzGravitation Members Posts: 7,205
    edited April 2010
    great l wrote: »
    Jay of course. Lots of people get caught up with the hype and imagery that's Tupac. If your ass wasn't at least 15 when he died, you shouldn't even be posting.

    c/s
    aot of 🤬 dicc riding Pac when dude wasnt this big alive
  • thesynthesisthesynthesis Members Posts: 9,230 ✭✭✭
    edited April 2010
    great l wrote: »
    Jay of course. Lots of people get caught up with the hype and imagery that's Tupac. If your ass wasn't at least 15 when he died, you shouldn't even be posting.

    thats some 🤬 logic 🤬 ...

    thats like saying if u werent 15 when Bob Marly was alive then you have no right to call him GOAT or say that 🤬 the greatest reggae artist of all times...hip hop fans are so fickle...

    if you werent 15 when, aaliyah died then she cant be a goat to you...🤬 🤬 with that dumb logic

    🤬 i started listening to music since 7, i was into mj, when i was 10 i got in to cube....why does a 🤬 have to be 15 to start listening music? wtf

    🤬 act dumb intentionally ?

    the reason why pac get more love than all the other dead rappers.. i.e big l. pun, biggy, left eye, 🤬 c..is because he made better music
  • thesynthesisthesynthesis Members Posts: 9,230 ✭✭✭
    edited April 2010
    Bob Marley died aged 36....no one in America was listening to his music, he never reached the top 5 here....then after he died, 🤬 started getting into his music and he reached n01 in the charts

    Bob Marly is a GOAT's.... it took for him to die for us to appreciate his music and to say damn i wish i had been around when that 🤬 was alive...this is the same way 🤬 look at pac

    Even though Pac had no1 records in America and around the world while alive, when he died 🤬 felt they missed out on seeing the man live,, 🤬 felt they missed out his future music and all the potential the man offered same way they do with Bob Marley

    Pac is hip hops Bob Marley
  • jekjek Members Posts: 1,786 ✭✭
    edited April 2010
    Man song for song Im going wit 2 Pac. Jay had some decent 🤬 back in the day but too bad Jay never stepped up when he had the chance to. Pac was letting Big and all them 🤬 have it. When Pac was gettin at them 🤬 like they was lil ass kids where was the great Jay Z?? Where was the hova that was suppose to be extra lyrical to make Pacs record disses absolete?? Probably in Foxy's house hiddin in the closet like a lil 🤬 ! Jay coulda proved right there that Pac couldn't 🤬 wit him but what he do?? decide to throw some subliminals after Pac died and Jack his beat for some 🤬 ass bonnie N clyde 🤬 . This whole debate got a hole in it N.E way because as big as Jay iz now...If Pac was still alive (BIG ALSO) Jay wouldna had the fan base he has now. He woulda still been in both of they shadow. Besided....if you really wanna make it fair, if you compare an even amount of they music that dropped and no Jay z 🤬 after 97 would be admitted, then Pac wins from song content to battle raps to commercial success. You cant put a 15 year catalog against a 6 year one.If Jay lost his life after six 🤬 woulda barely remember him except for reasonable dought fans which Jay dunt let down time and time again.
  • playmaker88playmaker88 Boy, I tell you that's vision Like Tony Romo when he hitting Witten Members Posts: 67,905 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited April 2010
    Pac.. jayz is one dimensional.. but he is still great. i appreciate greatness.. Tupac had an electric presence
  • thesynthesisthesynthesis Members Posts: 9,230 ✭✭✭
    edited April 2010
    comparing Pac to Hov is like comparing

    Jimi Hendrix ( who died at age 27) to Slash from Guns and Roses..both are legends, but Jimi still the GOAT, even if he was in the game for a short min

    Hendrix vs Slash? Hendrix

    Pac vs Jay ? Pac

    doesnt matter who had a longer run, it's about who revolutionized the art form, which clearly Pac did
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